Mearls on Balance in D&D

[MerricB]

It used to go like this in our games:

Fred: "I'll knock on the walls, looking for hollow areas"

Joe: "meanwhile, I'll check the edges of the door for trick hinges"

DM: "Fred, there is a hollow sound just behind the bedstead. No obvious way of opening it though. Nothing around the door, Joe."

Joe: "I'll try each of the torch sconces"

DM "The third torch sconce moves, and with a creak the secret door opens"

If I may note - there was a distinct difference between searching for traps, which was handled by a die roll - and searching for secrets, which often was role-played. (And it also depended greatly on the DM and adventure).

Cheers!

 

[Mouseferatu]

Hmm...

First, I'd point out that the KotB review in question was written eight years ago. I'm not sure Mike was even working professionally in the industry at that point.

Second, I like KotB, but that doesn't mean I ignore the fact that it's a deeply flawed module. While I disagree with the review's ultimate conclusion--that the module is a waste of time--the truth is, every specific point he raises is a genuine problem.

 

[phindar]

And it was funny. One of the genre tags was "comedy". I've written reviews (for my college newspaper, so its not that cool) and its a lot more fun to savage something than it is to be fair. And it always bothered me that no one in the Keep had names. (I guess I was in the 6th grade when I read KotB the first time. I thought the main guy in the keep was named "Castellan".)

 

[Hussar]

It used to go like this in our games:

Fred: "I'll knock on the walls, looking for hollow areas"

Joe: "meanwhile, I'll check the edges of the door for trick hinges"

DM: "Fred, there is a hollow sound just behind the bedstead. No obvious way of opening it though. Nothing around the door, Joe."

Joe: "I'll try each of the torch sconces"

DM "The third torch sconce moves, and with a creak the secret door opens"

As was pointed out, looking for secret doors was a bit different. OTOH, our groups said, "We search for secret doors" and everyone picked up a D6 and rolled. 1 in 6 for most of us, 3 in 6 for the elf IIRC.

YMMV of course.

 

[Quasqueton]

"We search for secret doors" and everyone picked up a D6 and rolled. 1 in 6 for most of us, 3 in 6 for the elf IIRC.

And 90% of all modules had only a S marked on the map as info on a secret door. Rarely any mention in the text about how to open it (or even any mention of torch sconces anywhere in the dungeon).

Joe: "I'll try each of the torch sconces"

DM "The third torch sconce moves, and you feel a prick on your finger. Roll a save versus poison. But with a creak the secret door opens"

Joe: "I rolled a 6."

DM: "OK, well your eigth-level cleric dies."

Fred: "You should have let the thief check for traps first."

OR

Joe: "Hey, thief, check the torch sconces for traps."

Bill: "OK, I check all the sconces for traps."

DM: <rolls d%, gets 62> "You don't find any traps."

Joe: "I'll try each of the torch sconces"

DM "The third torch sconce moves, and you feel a prick on your finger. Roll a save versus poison. But with a creak the secret door opens"

Joe: "I rolled a 6."

DM: "OK, well your eigth-level cleric dies."

Bill: "Sorry, dude."

Quasqueton

 

[Reynard]

Kill pcs by cheating, the Mearls way.

And the Award for Best Misrepresentation of a Quote goes to...

 

[Quasqueton]

As for Mearl's review of KotB, I found it hilarious. Yes, he does pound pretty hard in the last couple paragraphs, but actually, I think he got it right -- if I remember correctly (don't remember where I read it) EGG said that he had to write that in about a week, between other projects.

Quasqueton

 

[Klaus]

Hmm...

First, I'd point out that the KotB review in question was written eight years ago. I'm not sure Mike was even working professionally in the industry at that point.

Second, I like KotB, but that doesn't mean I ignore the fact that it's a deeply flawed module. While I disagree with the review's ultimate conclusion--that the module is a waste of time--the truth is, every specific point he raises is a genuine problem.

Once again, the Mouse's sonar sense sees the truth.

Keep on the Borderlands, were it released today, would be met with nothing but complaints and derision.

 

[Garnfellow]

I also think if Mike were to re-write that review today, it would read very differently. From the perspective he was working in -- second edition style emphasis on role-playing, background, plot and character development, and verisimilitude -- KotB does suffer, and mightily.

But from a more contemporary design perspective -- with an increased emphasis on ease of use and ability to be quickly dropped into an existing game -- KotB actually holds up rather well. I have been able to use that module, or at least portions thereof, in almost every D&D game I've ever run in any edition and any setting.

Too much background information can be just as bad as too little, because it makes it harder to quickly drop the adventure into an ongoing campaign. This is why second edition is generally known as an era of great settings but not so memorable adventures. Night Below, for example, has many wonderful things going for it, but it always seemed like such a pain in the butt to adapt the first few sections of that adventure that I never ran it. The few second edition adventures that do stand out in my mind (like "Kingdom of the Ghouls") are ones that were pretty consciously returning to the 1st edition mode.

I have thought that the recent success of Dungeon magazine was due to the editors finding a real sweet spot between 1st edition and 2nd edition adventure backgrounds. If 1e had too little and 2e too much, their 3e adventures seem to be "just right."

 

[green slime]

And the Award for Best Misrepresentation of a Quote goes to...

Indeed. Incredible.