Medieval Town Size
- Thread starter fusangite
- Start date
![:]](http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/devious.png "Devious :]")
I think the guidelines in MMS:WE work pretty well. There's a few things I may want to change in the revision, but nothing concrete right now.
WmRAllen67
First Post
You could try this: http://www.io.com/~sjohn/demog.htm
There's an online version here: http://www.lucidphoenix.com/dnd/demo/business0.asp
I plugged "2000" into the top and it gave an area of ".05 miles or 33 acres", which I figure is about 366 meters to a side, if I've done my math right...
Or, 240 five foot squares by 240 five foot squares...
There's an online version here: http://www.lucidphoenix.com/dnd/demo/business0.asp
I plugged "2000" into the top and it gave an area of ".05 miles or 33 acres", which I figure is about 366 meters to a side, if I've done my math right...
Or, 240 five foot squares by 240 five foot squares...
Don't forget - there are usually some very large open areas - a square, usually a large church, and a keep that will require upping the total size if you're just using density (unless those areas are already factored into the density calculation.
I also wouldn't do the calculation based on one defender per yard of wall. You wouldn't plan to be stormed along every yard of your wall - that would take a surrounding force able to storm the whole thing - you'd surrender a town under those circumstances, at least using the lens of history rather than fantasy.
I also wouldn't do the calculation based on one defender per yard of wall. You wouldn't plan to be stormed along every yard of your wall - that would take a surrounding force able to storm the whole thing - you'd surrender a town under those circumstances, at least using the lens of history rather than fantasy.
This site
http://www.odysseyadventures.ca/articles/hadrian-wall/article_hadrianswall-forts.htm
has a nice map of a Roman fort for 500 or so men (a cohort) from Hadrian's wall. A garrison town would likely spring up around such a thing if it staid in place for anytime, so this may be a good place to start. Just add a few buildings clustered around each entrance.
http://www.odysseyadventures.ca/articles/hadrian-wall/article_hadrianswall-forts.htm
has a nice map of a Roman fort for 500 or so men (a cohort) from Hadrian's wall. A garrison town would likely spring up around such a thing if it staid in place for anytime, so this may be a good place to start. Just add a few buildings clustered around each entrance.
S'mon said:
If it's a fort, half that - 300 yards across, 1/36 a square mile.
BTW in White Dwarf's The Town Planner series reprinted in Best of White Dwarf Articles III, it uses a real late-medieval town as a model, AIR it was about that population or slightly larger, and 400 yards across within the walls. Pretty much all houses in a medieval town are terraced, a concept few US designers seem familiar with.
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Dr. Strangemonkey
First Post
The geography is going to matter a great deal, particularly in terms of their use of natural features as part of their fortification and economic strategies.
As are their attempts to secure food and water supply and their defensive strategy in engineering the place.
What sort of transportation network are they on?
Is there a prior city or structure the garrison is based on or in?
Is 2000 the full population including kids and elderly? How much are the demographics skewed by the garrison? What's the animal population?
I don't know that any of these will invalidate any of the more generic calculations but they are likely to skew them. Particularly in terms of surface area.
Good to see you again Fusangite. Hope your summer is going well.
As are their attempts to secure food and water supply and their defensive strategy in engineering the place.
What sort of transportation network are they on?
Is there a prior city or structure the garrison is based on or in?
Is 2000 the full population including kids and elderly? How much are the demographics skewed by the garrison? What's the animal population?
I don't know that any of these will invalidate any of the more generic calculations but they are likely to skew them. Particularly in terms of surface area.
Good to see you again Fusangite. Hope your summer is going well.
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TerraDave
5ever, or until 2024
I think you got your answer....but I will still reply...in terms of dwellings, in a fortified setting, population density could be very high indeed...but things like the houses of the high faluting, churches/temples, parts of the fortifications, ceremonial areas (squares...) could take up a lot of space.
In short, a lot of the town could be "public" space or for the powerfull, with a smaller fraction for actual habitation by the commoners.
In short, a lot of the town could be "public" space or for the powerfull, with a smaller fraction for actual habitation by the commoners.
Another guesstimate method I've used in the past is to have an average # of people per building (O=occupants). Then divide the population (P) by O, and you've got an estimate of how many buildings. From there, knowing how big the average building is, you can get a decent estimate.
I've used an estimate of 5 people per building (anachronistic view of the in-town family, ma, pa, 3 kids living above the shop). Obviously, barracks, inns, apartments, would have different sizes and O values.
I haven't seen the MMV series, but it sounds like it has a pretty thorough model to use.
Janx
I've used an estimate of 5 people per building (anachronistic view of the in-town family, ma, pa, 3 kids living above the shop). Obviously, barracks, inns, apartments, would have different sizes and O values.
I haven't seen the MMV series, but it sounds like it has a pretty thorough model to use.
Janx
