D&D 5E (2024) Mike Mearls explains why your boss monsters die too easily

Some people treat game mechanics as the in-game physics of the world the characters are in. One knows specifically how powerful they are (their level) and how many times they can take discrete actions each day (spell slots), including exchanging other discrete actions they have for ones they don't (using a 3rd level spell slot to cast a 2nd level spell frex), and exactly how much a certain amount of rest time is required of them to regain a discrete action they no longer have (Arcane Recovery). So the Wizard in-world can calculate all of that and know precisely how much they can do each and every day.

But other people translate the game mechanics into a narrative conceit. For instance, narratively translate spell slots into a pool of magical energy they can tap into to create magical effects (and I say 'narratively' because they are suggesting the in-world idea is magical endurance, and not the actual change of game mechanics to using Spell Points). For those players, the character might be able to cast a certain spell a whole bunch of times per day based on need (using their 2nd level spell slots and/or 3rd level, 4th level, Arcane Recovery etc.) but how and why there ends up being a limit is never worried about "in-world". At a certain point in a Wizard's career they might cast Scorching Ray just once on one day, but then 10 times the next. And how and why that occurs within the world is just due to what the narrative ended up being-- not that it's because the game mechanic dictated that this was the only amount the character had the capability to do.

Neither way is the right way to look at it, and neither way is the wrong way to look at it. It just depends on how one makes the connection (if any) between mechanics and in-world effect. Me personally? I handwave so many hundreds of "mechanics as physics" issues throughout the course of a single game session-- where game mechanics make literally no sense to me as any sort of representation of "real life" in the game world... that I just give all mechanics a narrative washing over. I've stopped worrying about it. Why does the Wizard only cast Wish once per "long rest"? Because that's just what happened in the story that day, not because the physics of the world wouldn't let them cast it a second time. That's what works for me and is what I do. If others look at it a different way... that's cool. No skin off my nose. :)
 

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Yes! Though I find that having the time pressure is way easier with gritty rests, especially with sanctuary requirement. You of course can come up reasons why the thing must be done today, but it is a lot easier to come up with reasons why you cannot pack your bags and go home to chill for a week and then come back.
The problem here is that it assumes that PCs are too dumb to know there is always time pressure. And you know what is one of those unspoken time pressures? Boredroom. You are playing an adventurer, which means you WANT to go on an adventure. If you wanted to chill in your home, you would not be an adventurer. Not to mention often PCs have their own, eprsonal time pressures. Like, let's go back to your Orion Acaba impression:
"My magic has yet to recover. We may still face significant peril, so I say we wait a day or two before we face the enemy head on."
Paladin: "The monster behind these attacks will keep killing more people until we put an end to it. I'm not letting them claim another victim just because you're a coward."
Rogue: "My husband's killer is still walking the streets, the sooner we're done here, the sooner I can go back to hunting him. I'm not wasting my time just because you got a bubu on your wee little toe and need to run back to mommy to kiss it and make it better."

I guess it is a good comparison and I find endless CGI-filled and risk-free fight scenes in modern action movies tiresome as well. It is just so formulaic and repetitive. 🤷
Because old-school movies had such action scenes where it always looked like hero was in danger, huh?
 

I guess it is a good comparison and I find endless CGI-filled and risk-free fight scenes in modern action movies tiresome as well. It is just so formulaic and repetitive. 🤷
The good ones add lota of weird variety: woth D&D, you can do things like throw in a weird monster or three.

Really never found it repetitive: one of my personal best D&D experiences was playing a Dwarf Champion Fughter in one of Perkins plahtest era dungeon crawls. Felt great.
 

Why does the Wizard only cast Wish once per "long rest"? Because that's just what happened in the story that day, not because the physics of the world wouldn't let them cast it a second time. That's what works for me and is what I do. If others look at it a different way... that's cool. No skin off my nose. :)

So my issue with this is that the character and player decision space becomes divergent. Like the characters cannot make plans based on the knowledge that the wizard can cast only one wish per day. Players might want to make such plans though taking this information into account. So then we are just metagaming mechanics and that is really not what I play RPGs for. 🤷
 


Sorry, but I still do not see the class levels, so you do not know if you are taking challenges appriopriate for your abilities; I do not see exact number of hit points, so you know how much risk of dying next fight is going to put youat and whenever you need to recover; I do not see which of y our abilities require 8 hours of sleep, and which ones jus an 1 hour nap. Whatever you can know about your physical state is not conveyed through any sort of game mechanics. I do not see a reason why should it be different for characters existing within the world of the game. Sure they can give you equivalent of things you listed....no wait, they cannot, most of them do not have a magic item scanning them nor an overseeing organization keeping track of their health. Just like irl a vast majority of people in real world is not aware of their exact health, ofter under or overestimaging their abilities or endurance. FFS, look no further than all those dudes claiming they can beat Serena Williams in her area of expertise just because they believe a level 1 dude is inherently superior to a high level woman.
Have you noticed that each time you are presented with evidence or example of why a PC absolutely could & probably should be aware of how their recovery works in relation to the 5mwd you drag out a different mechanical element in a new context and declare victory? It's quite the pattern. Even if the PCs have no concept of time & have just decided they plan to rest until recovered, it's not going to take too many times before they notice the obvious timeframe for "until rested".

This has progressed all the way from individual posters providing examples of being able to self gauge their workout recovery needs and specifical forces teams posters apparently served with being trained to remember/recognize medically and combat relevant details in real time being dismissed on the grounds that those posters class levels and exact hp are not knowable that poster can't judge their"risk of dying in a fight".


You have done an admirable job of demonstrating why sometimes the rules design needs to flatly ignore the impossible quantum goalpost on roller skates desired by theater geeks and write some parts of the ruleset RAW+RAI from somewhere well into the wargamer side of the spectrum just so folks can actually play the game rather than being flogged by some unknowable eldritch horror from beyond the veil. It's even led me to this fascinating study. That's not to say that there aren't areas where the reverse is true, just that it tends to be a lower bar for the needs of the game to be accepted under those conditions when wargaming is the wrong mindset for something like diplomancy or whatever.
 

Paladin: "The monster behind these attacks will keep killing more people until we put an end to it. I'm not letting them claim another victim just because you're a coward."
Rogue: "My husband's killer is still walking the streets, the sooner we're done here, the sooner I can go back to hunting him. I'm not wasting my time just because you got a bubu on your wee little toe and need to run back to mommy to kiss it and make it better."

Then you have time pressure. And the GM should provide these instead of blaming the players for wanting to take a rest.
My point was never that this waiting to rest is thing that should constantly be happening, my issue was with you blaming the players for what is a rule and GMing issue.

Because old-school movies had such action scenes where it always looked like hero was in danger, huh?

More often, yes. They felt more real as they had to be done practically, instead of being impossibly floaty weightless CGI slop. There also were less of them, as using practical effects was more expensive.
 

You have done an admirable job of demonstrating why sometimes the rules design needs to flatly ignore the impossible quantum goalpost on roller skates desired by theater geeks and write some parts of the ruleset RAW+RAI from somewhere well into the wargamer side of the spectrum just so folks can actually play the game rather than being flogged by some unknowable eldritch horror from beyond the veil.

Hey, I am more of "a theatre geek" and this is exactly why I want the rules to correspond to the fiction! I want it being possible to talk about things in-character as much as possible, instead of the game aspect being diverged purely on the meta level.
 

Hey, I am more of "a theatre geek" and this is exactly why I want the rules to correspond to the fiction! I want it being possible to talk about things in-character as much as possible, instead of the game aspect being diverged purely on the meta level.
Yea, I'd agree with you on that. The way 5e pressures a 5mwd nova loop actively undermines the world & turns PCs into starfish aliens rather than individuals with knowable motivations & goals that can be related to.

I can't find the video right now but dungeoncraft/professorgm did a good video on wargamers & theater geeks a few weeks ago. I've always seen the terms as being about as descriptive for discussion as forge's 3 pillars & not something that ascribes merit or value:D
 

So my issue with this is that the character and player decision space becomes divergent. Like the characters cannot make plans based on the knowledge that the wizard can cast only one wish per day. Players might want to make such plans though taking this information into account. So then we are just metagaming mechanics and that is really not what I play RPGs for. 🤷
Like I said, different strokes, different folks.
 

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