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D&D 5E Minor actions

Incidental actions are free in 5E to a certain extent, but i like the use of movement for some task/action that my be too undertaking to be free but not enought to take an action. The use of bonus action can also be another alternative for this sort of things.
 

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Incidental actions are free in 5E to a certain extent, but i like the use of movement for some task/action that my be too undertaking to be free but not enought to take an action. The use of bonus action can also be another alternative for this sort of things.

I like the" mouvement budget" idea
and yes a quite simple one but with a clear list.
So PC knows what he can do or not and at what cost.
 

I like the" mouvement budget" idea
and yes a quite simple one but with a clear list.
So PC knows what he can do or not and at what cost.

I think movement being spent to perform actions is a VERY dangerous path to go down, potentially leading to a far more complex action economy than previous editions. Hopefully they avoid that.
 

Given that wasn't it's role in 4E (unless you would also describe 2E that way), it's hard to see how it can have "moved away from it". You really seem a bit sneering here.

I suppose that came across badly. I was making an Order of the Stick reference--though now I think about it, it's in one of the prequel books rather than the main strip. Belkar says something derogatory about Roy being a meat shield, Roy responds by touting his Master of Battle Administration from Fighter College, and Belkar asks him what courses he took, whereupon Roy is forced to admit to having taken "Standing In Front of Other People 101."

Certainly there was more to 4E Defender-ing than just literally standing in front of other people. But that doesn't change the fact that 4E fighters were explicitly described as Defenders! Their job was to lock down the monsters and keep them from engaging the other PCs. Like any 4E character, they could dish out a fair bit of damage, but it wasn't their specialty. If you wanted to lay down a lot of hurt fast, you were better off as a ranger or a rogue.

The 5E fighter has unarguably shifted hard in the offensive direction. As you yourself just observed, their options to protect other PCs are much reduced from 4E. On the other hand, they now deal damage faster than anyone else, except in the case of a wizard fighting a mob. It's a tradeoff.

Er, not really. In 4E the big deal for Fighters is controlling enemy movement, not imposing a penalty on attacks (which 5E has a moderately decent provision for via a Feat). The point was that the Fighter could go lockdown dangerous enemies and keep them from going where they wanted to - severely punishing them if they ignored him. This happened via a combination of Combat Challenge (immediate action) and OA benefits. He didn't have to hang out with whoever he was protecting. Indeed, if you were there, you'd generally already failed.

Well, now you're asking not just to have 5E fighters retain the ability to protect people, but to do it the same way it was done in 4E.

I mean, if you want fighters to be able to go out, engage a bunch of foes, and hinder their movement, that's simple enough. Give the fighter a sweep attack targeting all adjacent enemies. The attack deals minimal damage but knocks enemies prone. Does it work the same way as the 4E fighter? Certainly not. But does it accomplish the stated goal? Absolutely.

Even if you want the 4E fighter ported straight into 5E with all abilities intact, there's no reason why we need a whole separate action type just to support one class. Instead, the 4E fighter can bring her own little bubble of 4E rules and apply them to herself, thusly:

Combat Superiority: You don't expend your reaction to make an opportunity attack in response to an enemy's movement. If the attack hits, the enemy loses all remaining movement for this turn.

In some ways I think it works better in 5E than in 4E. In 4E, Combat Superiority (and opportunity attacks in general) let you jump into the middle of an opponent's move action and do stuff while the move action sat there half-finished, which always struck me as a clunky system. Maybe it's the SQL developer in me, but it rubs me the wrong way to have actions be non-atomic.

In 5E, the fact that movement is not a discrete action simplifies matters. Each square of movement is its own thing, and no issues are raised by jumping in to act between one square and the next.
 
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When i saw this, i imagined rules like that :
to drink a potion or sheathe your weapon, it costs 2 points of mouvement ( of 10 feet ) ... but i havn't seen stuff like that.

What do you think ?
In an earlier playtest packet, they had something call Incidental Actions, that were similar to Minor Actions. They didn't require your action, and you could do as many of them as your DM thought reasonable. A group I knew used a rule similar to yours, except it was -5' of movement for the first Incidental Action, -10' for the second, and -15' for the third. They felt that it represented the time required quite well, and I agree.

If you like your rule, you can easily incorporate it into your game. With 5E's modularity, houserules I feel will once again be common.
 

Combat Superiority: You don't expend your reaction to make an opportunity attack in response to an enemy's movement. If the attack hits, the enemy loses all remaining movement for this turn.

In some ways I think it works better in 5E than in 4E. In 4E, Combat Superiority (and opportunity attacks in general) let you jump into the middle of an opponent's move action and do stuff while the move action sat there half-finished, which always struck me as a clunky system. Maybe it's the SQL developer in me, but it rubs me the wrong way to have actions be non-atomic.

In 5E, the fact that movement is not a discrete action simplifies matters. Each square of movement is its own thing, and no issues are raised by jumping in to act between one square and the next.


I like your idea!

Pin Down: A creature within 5ft of the fighter trying to move must make a Dexterity Save, if they fail, they cannot move that round.

you could also just do something similar to warhammer quest pinning rules ... either the fighter makes a Pinning attack and that creature can't move till they make a save at the start of their turn.
 

Well, now you're asking not just to have 5E fighters retain the ability to protect people, but to do it the same way it was done in 4E.

Is that unreasonable? I honestly don't think that it is.

The point was that in 4E you could do it and remain in an aggressive posture and protect multiple people in real terms. The previous system you proposed forced you to hang back and protect a single individual.

I mean, if you want fighters to be able to go out, engage a bunch of foes, and hinder their movement, that's simple enough. Give the fighter a sweep attack targeting all adjacent enemies. The attack deals minimal damage but knocks enemies prone. Does it work the same way as the 4E fighter? Certainly not. But does it accomplish the stated goal? Absolutely.

Not something WotC would ever get away with, as people would flip their shiz if a Fighter could reliably do that (no matter if a magic-user of some description could do the same, of course!).

Even if you want the 4E fighter ported straight into 5E with all abilities intact, there's no reason why we need a whole separate action type just to support one class. Instead, the 4E fighter can bring her own little bubble of 4E rules and apply them to herself, thusly:

Combat Superiority: You don't expend your reaction to make an opportunity attack in response to an enemy's movement. If the attack hits, the enemy loses all remaining movement for this turn.

In some ways I think it works better in 5E than in 4E. In 4E, Combat Superiority (and opportunity attacks in general) let you jump into the middle of an opponent's move action and do stuff while the move action sat there half-finished, which always struck me as a clunky system. Maybe it's the SQL developer in me, but it rubs me the wrong way to have actions be non-atomic.

In 5E, the fact that movement is not a discrete action simplifies matters. Each square of movement is its own thing, and no issues are raised by jumping in to act between one square and the next.

I like this and agree. I just don't expect to see anything remotely like it in the 5E ruleset within the next three years (after that, maybe, things inevitably broaden out).
 

The 5E fighter has moved sharply away from "Standing In Front of Other People 101." It's a much more offensively oriented class than in 4E. While you do get a few options like the Protection fighting style, the main way you protect your allies is to butcher every monster that comes within your reach.

If the designers wanted to re-create a 4E-style defender fighter, it would be easy to do so without relying on OAs. Here's an example of how it could be done:

Bodyguard: Choose an ally you can see. While you are within 5 feet of that ally and able to take actions, attacks against that ally have disadvantage.

This is a fundamental misunderstanding and misrepresentation of 4E style defender fighters. 4E fighters work on the basis that the best defence is a good offence and that they butcher anyone who dares take their eyes off them. To recreate a 4e style defender fighter you'd want something more like the following ability:

Mark For Death: Choose an enemy. While you are within five feet of that enemy and able to take actions, you get a free attack against that enemy whenever they take an action that isn't either attacking you or going completely on the defensive you get a free attack against them. If their action would normally provoke an opportunity attack the part of their action they have not taken before you attack also negated if you hit The enemy is aware of this, and the same enemy can not be marked for death by two fighters.

This is much more aggressive than the Next fighter - and a decent approximation of the 4e fighter's Combat Challenge and Combat Superiority class features. The 5e Fighter has reverted to "Standing In Front Of People Waving Sharpened Metal 101" when the 4E fighter was "Getting in their face and being terrifying enough they don't dare take their eyes off you even for a split second 304"
 

This is much more aggressive than the Next fighter - and a decent approximation of the 4e fighter's Combat Challenge and Combat Superiority class features. The 5e Fighter has reverted to "Standing In Front Of People Waving Sharpened Metal 101" when the 4E fighter was "Getting in their face and being terrifying enough they don't dare take their eyes off you even for a split second 304"
While this is mostly true, the 5E fighter mostly defends by PURE offense now. Do you really want to attack that Rogue standing there with a dagger who only does 1d4+4 points of damage on a non-sneak attack? Or are you going to going to take down the Fighter before he gets another 3 attacks against you for 2d6+4?
 

While this is mostly true, the 5E fighter mostly defends by PURE offense now. Do you really want to attack that Rogue standing there with a dagger who only does 1d4+4 points of damage on a non-sneak attack? Or are you going to going to take down the Fighter before he gets another 3 attacks against you for 2d6+4?

That depends. Do I think what I'm carrying will be any use against the fighter's steel armour at all? And I'd honestly rather take down the wizard - who is much more potentially threatening than the fighter, and much squishier.
 

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