Mixed Signals from Wizards of the Coast

[TerraDave]

the ongoing problem of software development by Wizards seems to have raised its ugly head again.

A head that has been raised periodically for many, many years now.

 

[surfarcher]

I covered it for your Surf.

Ah thanks... I think... There's at least three ways I can read that so I figure there's a couple typos in there

I would point out, as has been mentioned, that software development is always a tricky proposition. With regard to Essentials, I also think its likely more difficult than the standard update. While I do not have either the Red Box or HotFL, my understanding is that at least some of the Essentials characters involve making major changes to the character archetype (like eliminating daily powers). This is obviously a tad more involved than simply placing a new feat into the compendium/CB for instance.

As someone involved in professional software desiogn for 20+ years let's have a think about this. Good design principles dictate that a major rewrite should be unnecessary to include the changes Essentials introduces. In addition WotC program design and coders should have had a very good idea of roughly what was going to be included for at least six months. But they'll still be at least two months overdue in release. That screams bad design to me.

I agree that its frustrating not to have the Essentials line in CB yet, but I also have to say that with respect to the CB, WotC has been really good with the updates til now. Of course, their Adventure Tools is another matter altogether but I digress.

Agreed.

Just spitballing here, but...

Do you have any personal contacts here in the states that would be willing to send you some copies of whatever books you wanted? At least for personal use.

Nope, not yet. And previously it hasn't been an issue. But I'm kinda... anxious... to get my hands on HOTFL

While it doesn't address the problem you're raising, it should be a good temporary remedy: Book Depository - free shipping, 7-14 days to Australia. Not as good as parallel release, not as bad as 2 month delay.

Sweet! Thanks for that!

Listen to this man!

I work in software developement as well and everything he is said here is true.

Software just isnt like other products. Software is capricious and most of the time written with requirements which change over time, meaning often the things that were true when written are not true later, and massive refactoring efforts and regression risk must be taken on, which ALWAYS blows out project timelines.

And that is exactly what would be happening at WOTC. DSUN and essentials has brought out a number of changes which are incompatible with existing rules within the software architecture, and as a result, whole modules need to be replaced. This expands testing schedules and throws resource allocation into disarray.

In a nutshell : Its not a sign of malicious or evil intent, its not a sign of incompetence. Its just something that happens, every day in many, many software projects around the world.

I for one am glad they are taking their time, because it means that they are taking the quality of the result seriously. I would be far more upset if they got a solution in on time and it was sub-standard or buggy.

Like I said I've been in S/E for 20+ years. They'll have had minimum 6 months to meet deadline and good design should negate a complete or major rewrite. I can only assume their design isn't what it should be.

But I've seen that lots of times. More than I can count, I wouldn't even try to remember. I have been through a lot of redesigns and rewrites

I think what we are seeing is actually pretty normal in software design and delivery - it is written by humans folks. Remember that.

 

[Roland55]

FWIW, I have passed a link to this thread up to WotC.

"You must spread ..."

As usual, you are both kind and particularly observant.

 

[ExploderWizard]

In addition WotC program design and coders should have had a very good idea of roughly what was going to be included for at least six months.

You assume such persons exist.

 

[surfarcher]

You assume such persons exist.

Touche! LOL. Well the latter must exist or there wouldn't be a CB & MB

In my professional experience the problems occur when the former doesn't.

 

[MerricB]

Update: the latest stock from Wizards got into my FLGS today. Not that it can be sold yet, but...

* Gamma World
* Gamma World boosters
* Essentials DM Kit
* Essentials Town tiles

However, we *still* haven't seen

* Essentials - D&D Rules Compendium
* Essentials - Heroes of the Fallen Lands

Huh?

Cheers!

 

[Amphimir Míriel]

Here in Mexico City there is only one store that sells D&D products, and according to the owner, it almost seems like Wizards of the Coast doesn't actually want them to carry D&D!

Apparently, Wizards REQUIRES that everyone in Latin America wanting to sell WotC products buy from Devir, their designated Spanish-language publisher and distributor.

Problem is, Devir is IN FRIGGIN' SPAIN!!

So, to get this straight, if someone in Mexico wants to sell D&D books, the books need to ship from Washington State, USA, cross an entire ocean, to Spain, and then cross the same entire ocean back to Mexico.

So, when he does get stock, he gets it late and he has to sell it for quite a lot more than the sticker price.

Anyone else see a problem here?

I mean, the guy means well and he even hosts the D&D Encounters events (a week or two later than every other store), and several local guys make the effort to buy stuff from him instead of just getting it through Amazon (even with 4-6 week international shipping, you get stuff cheaper and faster that way)

 

[UHF]

Update: the latest stock from Wizards got into my FLGS today. Not that it can be sold yet, but...

* Gamma World
* Gamma World boosters
* Essentials DM Kit
* Essentials Town tiles

However, we *still* haven't seen

* Essentials - D&D Rules Compendium
* Essentials - Heroes of the Fallen Lands

Huh?

Cheers!

Do tell us what they say. I do care.. all the way from Canada. I want to know what they will do to improve your situation.

Be forceful. Don't take the, "Get used to it kind of response."

Also... it may have something to do with your government import restrictions. Lordy knows I've been reamed by Canada customs a few times. You may have to pay a bit more to speed things up...

 

[ObsidianCrane]

As a fellow Aussie, I'm pleased to hear that the DM Kit came in this month, along with the city tiles but I'm tired of this unavailability of the Heroes of the Fallen Lands book.

I WANT to support my LGS, the owner wants to support us, but WotC is making his situation impossible.

There are 40-50 of us that play LFR at the store, and while HotFL isn't legal for that campaign yet it will be by the end of this month. That doesn't even go to the Encounters issue Merric has already mentioned.

When I phoned up on release day to find out if HotFL had arrived, the owner told me of the October release date. I pulled the image showing September 21st release date from the WotC site and e-mailed it to him. He forwarded it to WotC Australia (and CC'd me) and recieved no response or explanation.

If the Character Builder had been updated, then I wouldn't have a problem. I could wait indefinately for the book to arrive because I'd have the rules (yes I'm addicted) and not have to ponder about buying the book from the US instead of my LGS. But no, the character builder is on hold as well. Strange how the release of an update of the CB with HotFL in it is creeping back to coincide with the delayed release of the book in Australia... Yes WotC I have news for you, I will buy the book even though it is in the CB. The book's classes are of interest to me, so I'll buy it. I want to buy it from my LGS, and I wanted to do that on Septeber 21st.

But instead the "nostalgia" feel of Essentials products for Australians seems to include the delays in getting products that we experienced back in the 80's and 90's, not something I wanted to experience again.

 

[Jack99]

Really?

Yep