MMORPG madness!

[Dark Jezter]

As many of you unlikely know by now, E3 has wrapped up, and many more MMORPG titles have been announced. The total number of MMORPGs in development is currently staggering, so I thought I'd create a thread where people could discuss these upcoming online worlds.

I'll start off with some thoughts of my own on a few of the titles.

World of Warcraft: This is the MMORPG I'm looking forward to the most. First off, I'm a big fan of the Warcraft setting, and thing it will be an ideal place to set an MMORPG. Second, Blizzard hasn't let me down yet, so I have great faith in them to put out another great game. Third, this developers look like they are working hard to avoid the problems that have plagued other MMORPGs, such as kill-stealing, PKing, item farming, etc.

The Matrix Online: I'll definately be keeping an eye on this one. The combat system sounds very unique, and the game itself is supposed to offer great depth; if you can see a skyscraper, you can explore every floor in the building.

Middle Earth Online: Looks great based on the graphics, and the opportunity to explore various Middle Earth locations (the Shire, Mines of Moria, etc) is very inviting. I'm just worried that the game will be flooded by Legolas fanboys and we'll be seeing 50 elf archers for every 1 human, dwarf, or hobbit. The thought of elves suddenly becoming the most populous race in Middle Earth just seems wrong.

Star Wars Galaxies: Fan of the movies, but for some reason it's hard for me to get excited about this title. We'll have to see how it does.

Dungeons & Dragons Online: Frankly, I don't know how the hell they're gonna pull this one off without rewriting the D&D rules almost entirely. If they keep true to the rules, we'll be seeing level 20 characters within 24-48 hours of the game's release, among other things. D&D works great on a small scale, but I can't imagine a D&D game with thousands of PCs working easily.

EDIT: Added thoughts about D&D Online.

 

[Felon]

You know, after playing pretty much every MMORPG out there to date, I find it harder and harder to get excited about them anymore. Fantastic idea, but the execution falls way short of the grand premise.

Even with MMORPG's becoming all the rage, it doesn't seem like anyone is trying to create a living, breathing world. Rather, they just imitate DAoC and ShadowBane, taking the path of least resistance by creating plastic worlds that are essentially just big PvP battlefields. I never got the appeal of that myself, since you can get a better, faster PvP experience playing an FPS online.

Personally, I like the thought of monsters that aren't just content to sit one static spot and scratch their butts until some PC virtually walks up to their face. I'd like to see them slowly build up in population so that, if left unchecked, they start expanding. Roads and outposts start experiencing raids, small at first but slowly increasing in size and frequency until they become overwhelming. Eventually, unregulated mob spawns start reaching the outskirts of towns. If still no action is taken, towns themselves will be ransacked.

Of course, I'd also like to see other reasons to play in a living world than combat. I for one love to explore the hinterlands of the worlds I play in, but am always disappointed to find that there isn't anywhere I can go that isn't easily accessable to every other character. Partially that's because avatars can survive anywhere. They don't need food or shelter, so playing a wilderness-survival archetype doesn't amount to a lot (usually just a running buff).

Of all the games listed, I expect SWG will be the biggest hit, and Middle Earth and D&D will be the biggest flops. Sony and LucasArts is doing a great job of listening to players and tweaking the game accordingly. They also have done a good job of steadily releasing more and more info about the game, rather than keeping the game a secret until two weeks before launch. Turbine, OTOH, has a terrible track record with all of the aforementioned. Frankly, it boggles my mind how they could have landed both the LotR and D&D franchises with the stench of Asheron's Call 2's unmitigated failure hanging about them.

 

[KenM]

I HATE the whole concept of "pay to play games". I go to the store, pay $40-$60 for a game, then I have to pay 10-15 a month just to play it? Lets see, I can play EQ, that costs money, or I can get the same playing experance with neverwinter nights and not pay extra, I wonder what game I'm going to play? Please don't tell me its server costs, ect., Blizzard has run battle.net at no cost to the players for a number of years, you can play countless other games online for free. MMORPG's are nothing but cash cows.

 

[Andrew D. Gable]

The Matrix Online: I'll definately be keeping an eye on this one. The combat system sounds very unique, and the game itself is supposed to offer great depth; if you can see a skyscraper, you can explore every floor in the building.

Middle Earth Online: Looks great based on the graphics, and the opportunity to explore various Middle Earth locations (the Shire, Mines of Moria, etc) is very inviting. I'm just worried that the game will be flooded by Legolas fanboys and we'll be seeing 50 elf archers for every 1 human, dwarf, or hobbit. The thought of elves suddenly becoming the most populous race in Middle Earth just seems wrong.

My friends and I have been talking about The Matrix MMORPG. Honestly, we didn't know it was coming out, but it's good to know us and game developers are on the same wavelength. But I see lots of this happening (you other MMORPG junkies'll get it):

"Dangit! I've been waiting here seven hours of RT for Agent Smith to spawn! I finally kill him and this here junkhead comes out of leftfield and ninja loots the body! Now I'll have to wait ANOTHER seven hours to get that stolen code to the Zion Mainframe!"

Middle Earth sounds cool.

 

[CrusaderX]

But wait, there's more!

EverQuest II - love it or hate it, this will sell big

Warhammer Online - not quite as popular as D&D, so it may get lost in the shuffle

Lejendary Adventures Online - again, not as popular as D&D

Horizons - long thought of as vaporware, it seems to have a new lease on life with Atari now behind it

Mythica - this one has the $$$ of Microsoft driving it

There's a ton of fantasy-themed MMORPGs scheduled to come out in the next few years, and I don't see how the market can sustain them all. I can see EQ2, LOTR, and D&D initially drawing in players due to their names alone, but they'll actually have to be good games to rise above the glut of fantasy MMORPGs we'll be seeing soon.

 

[Dark Jezter]

I HATE the whole concept of "pay to play games". I go to the store, pay $40-$60 for a game, then I have to pay 10-15 a month just to play it? Lets see, I can play EQ, that costs money, or I can get the same playing experance with neverwinter nights and not pay extra, I wonder what game I'm going to play? Please don't tell me its server costs, ect., Blizzard has run battle.net at no cost to the players for a number of years, you can play countless other games online for free. MMORPG's are nothing but cash cows.

That outlook is completely unrealistic. MMORPGs are an entirely different type of game than the RPGs and RTSs that run on battle.net and other free online gaming service. With MMORPGs, the game itself is stored on the server, while battle.net only provides you with a list of current games that are running. Battle.net is not a game server, it's a matchmaking service. The costs for running battle.net is insignificant compared to running an MMORPG.

If you need more information about why monthly costs are necessary, here's an article from a Star Wars Galaxies fan site explaining more...

Why Pay For An MMORPG?

By Damien Wyrmsbane

Why should you pay monthly for an MMORPG? You've already paid the 50 or 60 bucks at the store, so why is it that you've got to subscribe to this game like it's a service? Lots of people ask why they have to pay for the software if they have to pay for playing the game. Shouldn't the software be distributed freely if you have to pay for the pleasure of playing? There isn't a single answer to this, but I'll try to go about it in the most direct way that I can.

You pay for MMORPGs because they cost money to produce. Buying the software up-front is no different than you going to Electronics Boutique and buying the newest Final Fantasy. Production of a game cost money, and lots of it, and you, ladies and germs, have to pay for that production if you wish to partake in the game's wondrous pleasures.

But, Damien, you ask, why in the world do I have to pay a monthly fee if I've already paid for the game's development when I buy the software? Well, in most situations where you buy a video game, you don't pay a monthly fee, correct? Well, you also don't get updates (except random patches, if it's a PC game) and don't get new content added every week, month, etc. You don't get in-game support, and you don't get fixes to bugs whenever they are found. Console gamers have it the hardest, as their games, as a general rule, can't be patched and so they are stuck with what they buy. PC gamers have it easier in this respect, as some companies (Blizzard, for example) offer services where patches, updates, support, and fixes are provided free of charge.

Also, since you are reading this, I can only assume that you have access to the Internet. Duh, Damien. But, anway, unless you are getting your uplink from a school, university, work, or café of some sort, it is safe to assume that you have a monthly Internet bill to pay. Well, so does any company that runs an MMORPG. Except they have a tremendous Internet bill to pay. They also have to pay for the servers which hold and run the game, and these aren't just your run-of-the-mill "Dell Inspiron" PC's. These are top-of-the-line servers running 24-hours a day. They cost more to keep running for a month than most third-world countries see in a year. That's a lotta dough, and without a monthly fee from me, you, and all the other MMORPG addicts out there, there's no way that just selling software could keep the game afloat.

And there's another reason, as well. Are ya seeing a bigger picture than you once were, now? Well, this may be the most important of them all. People. Your monthly payment to Sony, EA, etc. pays their employees. Have you ever called a game-master for help? You pay his salary. Have you ever had a question about the game and in-game support helped you? You paid his salary. Have you ever had to call the company because something was wrong and you couldn't get into the game so someone had to walk you through it at 2:30 in the morning? Well, guess what? You paid his salary.

Monthly fees for an MMORPG are not just there for a corporate fat cat to sit in a velvet chair and eat filet mignon every night. Monthly fees are in place, because without them, we wouldn't be able to play the games we love. And even if the company did keep the game online, you wouldn't have the support or updates that you are so used to, and the game would go under. Fast. So next time that credit card bill comes in, don't mutter to yourself about paying montly for a game. You should relish in the fact that without your 10-15 dollars every month, this game wouldn't be possible. That without your 10-15 dollars every month, you would just be sitting in front of the TV watching In the Heat of the Night reruns, wondering what went wrong with your life. That without your 10-15 dollars, some tech-support worker's family couldn't have food on their table. Well, maybe it's not THAT drastic, but every subscriber makes a difference in the upkeep of an MMORPG, and that is why you have to pay a monthly fee.

 

[Tsyr]

Horizons... Mmmmmm.... *drools*

 

[KenM]

Well, in most situations where you buy a video game, you don't pay a monthly fee, correct? Well, you also don't get updates (except random patches, if it's a PC game) and don't get new content added every week, month, etc. You don't get in-game support, and you don't get fixes to bugs whenever they are found.

No new content? I guess the 2400+ modules I can download for neverwinter nights, FOR FREE is not considered new content. Or the hack packs, patches, portrits, ect. is not considered new content. Game expansions is considered new content. How about maps/ mods for Battlefield 1942? Or the bonus packs for UT2003, those are not new content? Or all the skins/ mods for freedom force is not new content? When I tryed to call EQ support, it was the worst support line I have EVER called. Why should I pay extra money when all the MMORPG games are just "what for big monster to respawan (along with 50 other players, and ONLY the person that gets the killing blow gets what the monster has) and you try to kill it, then you go onto the next monster when you level up. I play neverwinternights online and get a better online playing experence, and at end of the month, I'm $12.95 richer. If blizzard can do battle.net for free, so can other companies, MMORPGS are cash cows, thats the bottom line. I bet not one of the companies that run it will let us go into they're books and see what they cost to run and how much profit they make. If they are not making any profit, why are companies putting so many out?

 

[Dark Jezter]

No new content? I guess the 2400+ modules I can download for neverwinter nights, FOR FREE is not considered new content. Or the hack packs, patches, portrits, ect. is not considered new content. Game expansions is considered new content. How about maps/ mods for Battlefield 1942? Or the bonus packs for UT2003, those are not new content? Or all the skins/ mods for freedom force is not new content? When I tryed to call EQ support, it was the worst support line I have EVER called. Why should I pay extra money when all the MMORPG games are just "what for big monster to respawan (along with 50 other players, and ONLY the person that gets the killing blow gets what the monster has) and you try to kill it, then you go onto the next monster when you level up. I play neverwinternights online and get a better online playing experence, and at end of the month, I'm $12.95 richer. If blizzard can do battle.net for free, so can other companies, MMORPGS are cash cows, thats the bottom line. I bet not one of the companies that run it will let us go into they're books and see what they cost to run and how much profit they make. If they are not making any profit, why are companies putting so many out?

It appears as though you are wedded to your (false) belief that MMORPGs don't need to charge monthly fees to stay around. I explained to you that Battle.net and an MMORPG server are two entirely different things, but you didn't appear to hear a word of it. You insist on believing that all the money made by monthly fees goes to pad the pockets of gaming company executives.

If you are so opposed to the concept of MMORPGS, why are you even posting in this thread? Hmmm... what type of creature would do such a thing...

Troll
Large Giant
Hit Dice: 6d8+36 (63 hp)
Initiative: +2 (Dex)
Speed: 30 ft.
AC: 18 (-1 size, +2 Dex, +7 natural)
Attacks: 2 claws +9 melee, bite +4 melee
Damage: Claw 1d6+6, bite 1d6+3
Face/Reach: 5 ft. by 5 ft./10 ft.
Special Attacks: Rend 2d6+9
Special Qualities: Regeneration 5, scent, darkvision 90 ft.
Saves: Fort +11, Ref +4, Will +3
Abilities: Str 23, Dex 14, Con 23, Int 6, Wis 9, Cha 6
Skills: Listen +5, Spot +5
Feats: Alertness, Iron Will
Climate/Terrain: Any land, aquatic, and underground
Organization: Solitary or gang (2-4)
Challenge Rating: 5
Treasure: Standard
Alignment: Always chaotic evil
Advancement: By character class
Trolls speak Giant.
Combat
Trolls have no fear of death: They launch themselves into combat without hesitation, flailing wildly at the closest opponent. Even when confronted with fire, they try to get around the flames and attack.
Rend (Ex): If a troll hits with both claw attacks, it latches onto the opponent’s body and tears the flesh. This attack automatically deals an additional 2d6+9 points of damage.
Regeneration (Ex): Fire and acid deal normal damage to a troll. If a troll loses a limb or body part, the lost portion regrows in 3d6 minutes. The creature can reattach the severed member instantly by holding it to the stump.
Scrags
On land, scrags have a speed of 20 feet, and their swimming speed is 40 feet. They regenerate only if mostly immersed in water. Scrags are otherwise identical with their landbound cousins.

(Copied and pasted from the SRD, BTW)

 

[KenM]

I'm not going to waste my time by getting into a flame war with you. I did try everquest, I spent some time getting to like 5-6th level, then I died and when I respawned I LOST ALL MY STUFF that I had gotten. Then I find out I had to look for my old body to get my stuff back, and i looked and looked and could not find it, all that time completely wasted. No one Online wanted to help me. So I uninstalled, took the game back, and canceled my account. That was after waiting on hold to talk to a real person for almost an hour, but wait, this is a MMORPG, according to you, MMORPGS have great customer support. I'm am trying to tell people what a waste of money MMORPG's are. I play DnD with a guy, he was so happy awhile back because he got a new, second computer just so he can play EQ while he is playing EQ with the first computer, he pays for 2 accounts and plays on 2 computers at the same time, a total waste, IMO.