Monks & Weapons & Powers, oh my

[airaani]

What type of weapon you are using does not matter at all, except if it is magical and you wish to use it as an implement, you want it to be a weapon monks are proficient with. Weapons for monks are like staves for wizards or daggers for sorcerers...just an implement/"stat stick"

 

[DracoSuave]

What type of weapon you are using does not matter at all, except if it is magical and you wish to use it as an implement, you want it to be a weapon monks are proficient with. Weapons for monks are like staves for wizards or daggers for sorcerers...just an implement/"stat stick"

What type of weapon can matter greatly. An Eladrin Soldier with Pointed Step style, or perhaps with Headman's Chop might care a great deal as to what his weapon is.

 

[Kwalish Kid]

It's unclear whether a monk's unarmed attacks gets the benefit of a ki focus for all attacks or only melee attacks.

Not according to the description of ki implements on page 203 of the PHB3. One can use the bonus on all attacks made with weapons with which one is proficient. One cannot mix-and-match weapon enhancements with ki enhancements--one can use all of one on an attack or all of the other.

 

[Artoomis]

Not according to the description of ki implements on page 203 of the PHB3. One can use the bonus on all attacks made with weapons with which one is proficient. One cannot mix-and-match weapon enhancements with ki enhancements--one can use all of one on an attack or all of the other.

While I agree with you, that's not clear to everyone, and thus it is not clear. That's the way clarity works -if a significant number of people don't see it the same way, it is, by definition, not clearly written.

 

[Kwalish Kid]

While I agree with you, that's not clear to everyone, and thus it is not clear. That's the way clarity works -if a significant number of people don't see it the same way, it is, by definition, not clearly written.

Sorry, I thought that you were suggesting that the rules were ambiguous, not simply that some people who do not read the rules don't know them.

 

[DracoSuave]

While I agree with you, that's not clear to everyone, and thus it is not clear. That's the way clarity works -if a significant number of people don't see it the same way, it is, by definition, not clearly written.

Being able to use a ki focus as an implement means you can also use it with your weapon attacks. You can add its enhancement bonus to the attack rolls and the damage rolls of weapon attacks you make using a weapon with which you have proficiency. However, you must choose to use the enhancement bonus, properties. and powers of the ki focus, rather
than the weapon you're wielding, or vice versa. You can't use both when you use a power.

How would you write this more clearly?

Okay, also, on a second reading, you can't use a ki focus and a weapon on implement attacks (the number 4 above). Which makes using certain feats unusable with a ki-focus. However the monk feats work because using a weapon with flurry of blows is not the same thing.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Yet another question...

Are shuriken or reach weapons essentially pointless as monk weapons?

If all you can apply of a weapon's properties are the enchantments, it would seem like a reach weapon or a thrown weapon cannot deliver monk power attacks at reach or range...

IOW, is it correct to say a monk with magical shuriken can only gain the benefit from them with his monk powers by not throwing them (other than by the obvious use of being able to deliver a basic ranged attack with some magical bonuses, of course)?

 

[Zaran]

IOW, is it correct to say a monk with magical shuriken can only gain the benefit from them with his monk powers by not throwing them (other than by the obvious use of being able to deliver a basic ranged attack with some magical bonuses, of course)?

Well yeah. Same as a fighter. A monk is a melee based class. You can't apply ranged attacks to melee attack powers. That being said, you might be able to find powers that allow for reach attacks although I think most Monk powers are Melee 1.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Well yeah. Same as a fighter. A monk is a melee based class. You can't apply ranged attacks to melee attack powers. That being said, you might be able to find powers that allow for reach attacks although I think most Monk powers are Melee 1.

Yeah, except that it creates a cognitive dissonance that a "monk weapon" that is a throwing weapon is, in reality, no different than any other thrown weapon in the game. The designation is meaningless. The monk class should probably read as being able to use "any melee weapon" as an implement, because a throwable implement that functions thus only when not thrown is...supremely irritating.

And the same seems even more true for a reach weapon. Beyond delivering attacks that have no innate "monk-ness" (AoOs, powers from other classes), it looks as if a monk cannot deliver a monk attack power at reach, since weapon properties don't matter, only weapon enhancements.

 

[mneme]

There's no such thing as a "monk weapon" in 4e. There are weapons the monk is proficient with -- but a monk can use any implement they're proficient with as an implement -- not some limited list of "monk weapons" A githzerai monk will likely use a fullblade as an implement, and happily so.

Monks have a good number of "melee touch" powers (at least one at every level). So a monk that wanted to make a partial reach build could and take mostly powers with a range of Melee Touch and multiclass into Avenger and snag Aspect of Magesty (a daily that gives +1 to melee reach) -- or at paragon levels, say, wield a Blade of the Eldritch Knight, which reads:

Property: When you use a standard action to make a melee attack with this blade, your melee reach increases to 5 for that attack.

Since the BotEN increases your melee reach for all standard action attacks, this affects all your melee touch powers you chanel through it.