Monster Design--from a designer's standpoint

[Lizard]

I often wonder how we managed between 1974 and 1999 when monsters joined the party.

Until 1999, we played GURPS or Hero because they could answer those questions easily. Then 3e came around, and we could get back to our roots without sacrificing flexibility.

 

[hong]

I agree, that it makes some sense. But in the case of healing, have we had confirmed that you can not heal someone without surges? Because the text of Healing Word sounds to me, as if the spell has two effects: target can get a surge, and he heals 1d6+4 damage. That would make it possible to heal monsters, just less efficiently than normal characters.

That won't be enough, if you want your new buddy to last more than a couple of fights. It'll also mean you're (even more) dependent on the party medic, which is another thing that 4E is supposed to deal with.

 

[ObsidianCrane]

While I'm not in the least excited by the prospect of more Monster books, I am pleased to hear that my speculation on 4E Monster manufacture is about on target.

I rarely use more than say 40 or 50 monster species in a campaign - it just stops making sense to me. But the ease of customisation of a "species" into different sorts is also reflected by the comments in this thread - which is awesome.

This stuff really matches my "seat of the pants" style DMing.

 

[Mentat55]

I thought that on a natural 20, this beastie would just automatically do 14 points of damage, no dice rolled.

Some weapons do extra dice of damage on a crit, like the greataxe and war pick. In this case, the bonesnapper has something akin to the 3.x ability Augmented Critical, where some creatures had expanded threat ranges or crit multipliers with their natural attacks.

 

[Jack99]

That won't be enough, if you want your new buddy to last more than a couple of fights. It'll also mean you're (even more) dependent on the party medic, which is another thing that 4E is supposed to deal with.

I am just not sure the new rules take into account that monsters join up with players. When that is said, as a DM, I would most likely give it some surges a day, should that happen.

 

[Lizard]

I totally feel that way.

Scott and I were talking and I was talking with Erik Mona. Here was my rant of the particular day:

"Yeah, in 4E if I want my skeleton to just, I dont know, throw some black ball of banefire I can just say --Banefire, Range 6, 1d10 necrotic damage-- See, now it throws an evil ball of nastiness. Just like that."

Uhm, not seeing why you couldn't do this in 3e....

SA: Banefire. As a ranged attack, the skeleton hurls a ball of necrotic flame which does 1d6 Shadow damage and 1d6 Fire damage. Range Increment 30'.

All the rules for it are there -- it's a ranged attack. It provokes an AOO, responds to cover, etc. It's pretty straightforward. Even better, because it's a ranged attack, you can give the skeleton point blank shot and precise shot, and know they'll work properly with the attack, no special case rules needed.

Not saying 4e doesn't do this, or that it doesn't make a lot of things easier, but this wasn't a good example of it.

Now, trying to pick SLA for a high level demon..THAT was a nightmare with no real guidance as to what they should have, which should be 3/day or 5/day, etc. It was a total finger-in-the-wind crapshoot and a reason why a lot of my Cool Demon Ideas got turned into much more focused, simpler, monsters when I got around to statting them up...

And no cheesy rules lawyers can jump up and say, "hey, there is no PC spell for that! That's not FAIR!" and besides that is a 4 HD skeleton and so since it has magic, it is a 4th level wizard and we know 4th level wizards dont get fireballs even if thats what that was!! And on top of that the skill points dont add up!"

The MMs are all filled with monsters with 'unique' powers and I've never seen anyone bitch that they couldn't burrow like a bullette no matter what feats they took. I only bitch when presumed normal humanoids had 'special secret magic training' that let them do weird things...but a PC of the same race could never, ever, learn those tricks. (Hobgoblin Warcaster, I am looking at *you*!)

But fire-spewing skeletons? No big. "A wizard did it!"

 

[Jack99]

Some weapons do extra dice of damage on a crit, like the greataxe and war pick. In this case, the bonesnapper has something akin to the 3.x ability Augmented Critical, where some creatures had expanded threat ranges or crit multipliers with their natural attacks.

Yeah, there was another monster from DDXP that had the same ability (giving quadruple str damage on a crit). It was on one of the cards that was taken in a picture.

Edit: just NPC's, not any monster, my bad.

 

[hong]

I am just not sure the new rules take into account that monsters join up with players. When that is said, as a DM, I would most likely give it some surges a day, should that happen.

Oh, I wouldn't be surprised if the books didn't address this issue at all. This is what I'd do, in the absence of any published guidelines. Heck, if the published guidelines say something else, I'd probably do it this way anyway.

 

[Nellisir]

Big difference between making monsters for your home game and making monsters for published adventures.

Edit: never mind.

 

[Nellisir]

Uhm, not seeing why you couldn't do this in 3e....

SA: Banefire. As a ranged attack, the skeleton hurls a ball of necrotic flame which does 1d6 Shadow damage and 1d6 Fire damage. Range Increment 30'.

All the rules for it are there -- it's a ranged attack. It provokes an AOO, responds to cover, etc. It's pretty straightforward. Even better, because it's a ranged attack, you can give the skeleton point blank shot and precise shot, and know they'll work properly with the attack, no special case rules needed.
...
The MMs are all filled with monsters with 'unique' powers and I've never seen anyone bitch that they couldn't burrow like a bullette no matter what feats they took. I only bitch when presumed normal humanoids had 'special secret magic training' that let them do weird things...but a PC of the same race could never, ever, learn those tricks. (Hobgoblin Warcaster, I am looking at *you*!)

But fire-spewing skeletons? No big. "A wizard did it!"

My thoughts exactly.