D&D General Why do good monsters exist, from a game design standpoint?

[Edgar Ironpelt]

The good monsters don't have to be active allies to leaven the game with non-combat, non-hostile encounters. I like a generous mix of combat in my games, but 100% is too much; it's better world-building to avoid "Everything is trying to kill you, therefore you must try to kill[1] everything." That's a formula that can work in a computer or video game, but TTRPGs allow more variety, and that's an advantage to take advantage of.

[1] "Or flee like a shameless coward if you don't think you can take them."

 

[nevin]

For the purposes of this thread, I’m referring to monsters that are of good alignment as the default, as opposed to being potentially good. Blink dogs, flumphs, and the like. Most monsters are either neutral or evil, which makes sense given the implicit assumption in most campaigns that the PCs aren’t the villains and makes it easier to justify dungeon-crawling when the inhabitants are a threat to wider society. But while rare, there have been a few good-aligned monsters throughout D&D’s history.

They often serve to help worldbuilding, particularly in regards to verisimilitude. Such as angels being the servants of benevolent deities and the cosmic counterbalance to demons and devils, and why the Material Plane hasn’t been overrun with fiends. Or having close ties to the good-aligned PC races, like Giant Eagles being common allies of elves.

But what role are good-aligned monsters meant to have when it comes to game design? One could argue that they serve as allies to the party, particularly when viewed in the case of summoned monsters, but that set of spells hasn’t been universal throughout Editions. And in regards to the more explicitly powerful entities like ancient metallic dragons, storm giants, and solar angels, they can become a minor version of the Elminster Problem where one asks why they haven’t gotten around to dealing with some problem or other that the PCs must handle. Another argument I’ve heard is that they can be an alternative set of antagonists in campaigns where the PCs are evil-aligned or otherwise morally compromised, but evil campaigns tend to be rather rare. And the amount of good-aligned monsters that exist typically aren’t large enough to match the versatility and scale of the rest of the monster manuals.

So, what purpose do you think good-aligned monsters serve from a mechanical standpoint? I’m eager to hear people’s thoughts.

I feel obligated to point out not all characters are good and not all parties are good. Though I agree they are the vast majority.

 

[Blue]

But what role are good-aligned monsters meant to have when it comes to game design? One could argue that they serve as allies to the party, particularly when viewed in the case of summoned monsters, but that set of spells hasn’t been universal throughout Editions. And in regards to the more explicitly powerful entities like ancient metallic dragons, storm giants, and solar angels, they can become a minor version of the Elminster Problem where one asks why they haven’t gotten around to dealing with some problem or other that the PCs must handle. Another argument I’ve heard is that they can be an alternative set of antagonists in campaigns where the PCs are evil-aligned or otherwise morally compromised, but evil campaigns tend to be rather rare. And the amount of good-aligned monsters that exist typically aren’t large enough to match the versatility and scale of the rest of the monster manuals.

So, what purpose do you think good-aligned monsters serve from a mechanical standpoint? I’m eager to hear people’s thoughts.

Okay, you asked about from game design, and then nothing you had to say had to do with game design (mechanics and rules) and everything about what purpose they have in-world for adventure and/or setting design. So I'm going to handle that.

You've mentioned allies, there's the flip side of patrons. They could be there to rescue or save. They could be not aligned with the characters but someone they could potentially convince or convert. They can simply be NPCs, there's little difference between a high level fighter and a storm giant, a king and a dragon.

Basically, we know that good-aigned NPCs are used for. I don't get a feel that you're saying that good aligned "monsters" are unfit for all purposes a good-aligned NPC is, so that exhaustive list should answer this question completely.

 

[Faolyn]

Good monsters can become enemies, either by changing their alignment or by having an opposing viewpoint that goes against the party's. Law vs. chaos is one way to do that.

Also, evil PCs may want to fight good monsters.

 

[MechaTarrasque]

The primary reason is that you can give the good critters abilities that certain (sub)classes of PC's can aspire to. Admittedly, there is a lot of "chicken and egg" stuff going on, especially in early editions (there were a lot of paladins with wings), but we have had a lot of editions and a lot of good monsters (especially in 2nd edition) since then. [Similarly, I figure any time there is some neat ability that shows up for a fiend, fey, or aberration, I am disappointed if that doesn't find its way to warlocks in some fashion.]

Additionally, you give the DM's something with weight to nudge the PC's (in nonevil campaigns) away from bad behavior. As much as it amuses me having the next demon the PC's run across talk about what a big fan of their work he/she/it is (and how he/she/it heard that Orcus thinks there is a place for them in his organization), it doesn't have as much bite as when an angel calls the PC's "sons of Demogorgon" for whatever "this is totally CN" scheme they just tried...

 

[FitzTheRuke]

To Answer the Thread Title:

1) Because Good PCs need someone to fight alongside.
2) Because Evil PCs need someone to fight against. Aside from all the other monsters.
3) Mistakes happen. (I mean when choosing who to fight, not from a design standpoint, though that happens too, but this isn't one of them).

 

[smetzger]

1. Everything has a statblock
2. Everything has always had a statblock
3. So, you can have unusual allies and henchmen/followers
4. So, you can play as one of these creatures
5. So, your evil PC has something good to fight

 

[Libertad]

Is thread necromancy something a good-aligned monster would do?

But seriously, happy to see that this reinvigorated discussion!

 

[NN]

So, what purpose do you think good-aligned monsters serve from a mechanical standpoint? I’m eager to hear people’s thoughts.

this is where you are going wrong.

Monsters exist due to the logic of the world.

Monsters just designed to be mechanical challenges is cheese

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Three reasons.

1. Good creatures may aid the party at least some of the time. Hence, their combat statistics matter.
2. Good spellcasters may use spells which summon or conjure good creatures. That requires combat stats.
3. There can be times where you have Good vs Good conflicts. Rare, and difficult to write, but they exist.

Hence, from a game design standpoint, at least having a modest effort at designing good creatures is still useful, if your game includes any of: powerful good creatures aiding PCs, PCs summoning good creatures, or the possibility of two good beings coming to blows.

For an example of the latter, consider a falling-out between two different groups of good deities, who disagree about the correct path forward to resolve a problem. Maybe one side thinks direct action right away is absolutely necessary, while the other side thinks caution and patience are absolutely necessary. Regardless of who is right or wrong, it is at least possible that they could come to blows, if the "act NOW!" side forces the issue while the "no WAIT!" side tries to force them to wait. Again, easily becomes "one side was stupid (reckless or irresolute), the other smart" or other weak writing, but the core idea remains.

As a general rule, you'll see a lot more variety of evil creatures than good ones, in terms of combat statistics, because you don't need a ton of options to fulfill the three points above. Named leaders, basic footsoldiers, and a handful of higher-tier specialized units are all you really need.

And, of course, this is completely ignoring the obvious answer: Some parties of PCs are evil, and will thus have no problem fighting the forces of Good.