more monk questions: staffs, clubs

[Mort_Q]

not to thread-jack this...but what does RAW and RAI mean? i see it a lot and assume it's a common accronym, but can't figure it out. thanks.

Something like...

Rule As Written

Rule As Intended

 

[mneme]

Expanding on 1:

A monk's class describes their implement proficiencies as "ki focus, weapons with which you are proficient". Staffs are neither.

Untrue. Staffs are quarterstaffs, as per their definition. All quarterstaffs are staffs, all staffs are quarterstaffs.

Therefore, monks are capable of using staffs as an implement, and may take "Superior Impelmenent: Accurate Staff" (or whatnot) as a feat.

A more interesting (but not yet relevant) question is whether you can take a Superior Implement feat if you can only use -some- subcategories of that Implement (for instance, whether Sorcerers will be able to take Superior Implement categories for Light Blades even though they can only use Daggers -- assuming such categories ever exist).

 

[evilbob]

I still think you specifically have to have "staff implement" as a class option to get the feat. I'd love for an official clarification, though, because I completely understand your point and while I disagree I can't really fault you for that interpretation.


I think another interesting question is why they invented an entirely new type of implement in the PHB3 - ki focus - and then neglected to provide superior implement options for it.


Also: still no takers on question 2?

 

[Mort_Q]

I think another interesting question is why they invented an entirely new type of implement in the PHB3 - ki focus - and then neglected to provide superior implement options for it.

Psionic Powers drops in August (along with the Dark Sun products coincidentally). I remain optimistic.

 

[evilbob]

Still no thoughts on question 2, anyone?

 

[mneme]

re question #2 (that's the "staff in your on-hand, club in your offhand" one, right?): Aside from the silliness of letting monks use two-handed weapons as implements one-handed -- RAW, yes, but given that they're using them as weapons, still silly -- I don't see a problem with it.

Consider the flavor. A monk's Flurry is a replacement for the 3.5 "monks make more attacks" flury -- after they hit with an attack, they get to inflict some automatic damage, presumably by "flurying" with the rest of their body. As such, there's no reason this couldn't be with an off-hand club.

That said, there's an inherent penalty to doing so, as the staff wouldn't be usable on OAS -- Instead, a Crushing Surge of Ruin monk would have to attempt them with the off-hand club.

 

[evilbob]

That's how I see it, too. And I don't think losing out on OAs is that bad; unless monks pay a feat tax, their melee basic attacks are pretty crappy anyway. It could be argued that a dex/str-based monk would at least have a half-decent chance, but I don't think it's good enough to warrant worrying about the trade-off.

 

[Hamilburg]

2. Monks can use staffs as implements because they are quarterstaves. I think there is consensus on this. (They cannot, for example, use orbs or wands, however.) Because of this, one of their most powerful weapons automatically becomes a Staff of Ruin.

Enter the Crashing Tempest Style feat. Which says while you are wielding a club, you do +2 damage on a Flurry.

This means that for pure damage output, your best combination is to carry a non-magical (1g) club in your main hand, and also a Staff of Ruin in your off-hand, and use the staff as your conduit for all implement powers.

This is really, really dumb. However, can anyone find fault with that logic?

Staff of Ruin should work, but probably isn't the best choice since it is an item bonus. You can get an equivalent item bonus by using Iron Armbands (for any non-burst power) and would then be better served leveraging your weapons slot to get a non-item bonus (Cunning or Goblin-Totem if applicable would seem the obvious choices)

 

[evilbob]

Whether or not it is a good idea is not really the topic; that said, my opinion is that the monk has far too many burst/blasts to only rely on the iron armbands for extra damage. Ultimately, however, it depends on your build. If all of your attacks are melee 1/touch/weapon, then the armbands are a clear winner. If half are bursts, I think the Staff of Ruin is better.