Mortality Radio # 30: Ed Stark interview available...

[Steverooo]

Trap-Making Revisited

Okay, let's look at Craft (Trapmaking), and apply it to the Ranger, and also the Rogue...

First of all, there are no traps listed in the PHB, so no prices... Okay, let's assume we need a rope to set a snare... That's 1 GP, but what's the price to make the snare?

We don'no'... So, how long does it take to make the snare? Same answer. So let's assume the snare is FREE. Okay, so what's the DC for the Craft (Trapmaking) check? 5 (Very Simple)? 10 (Typical)? 12 (Simple Melee/Thrown Weapon)? 15 (High Quality/Martial Melee/Thrown Weapon)? 20 (Complex)? In any case, the minimum time to Craft (Trap) is one day.

But wait! Wilderness Lore says that the Ranger only needs to spend half a day to get food and water, possibly for more than one person, but he has to spend longer than that making the snare?

Now apply the same logic to the Rogue...

Setting traps is an area of 3e that has been pretty much left out. The DMG gives a lot of space to typical traps, but very little to making them. Obviously, this isn't something the designers wanted PCs getting into.

DMG:114-115 gives the "Building Mechanical Traps" rules. Here it states that it takes one week and 1,000 GP per point of CR to make a trap. Snares aren't listed, but a large net trap is CR 1. Thus, one week to set!

Obviously, a Ranger (or Rogue) can neither use that to gain food, nor against foes. Therefore; Craft (Trapmaking) is unusable for a Ranger, in-game, except during a week or more of downtime. Setting snares it is not, so it doesn't solve the problem.

Here's my solution:


Trapsetting (General)
You are familiar with deadfalls, limb-traps, nets, pits, snares, and other such simple traps usable in the outdoors.
Prerequisite: Free with Wilderness Lore 1+.
Benefit: You can set deadfalls and snares, or concealed pit traps, with a DC of up to 20, making them out of natural materials at hand.

This is a General Feat, available to anyone, with a Prerequisite of one or more Ranks in Wilderness Lore/Survival. Rangers get it as a freebie at level one, but it is only usable IF they have WL 1+. Craft (Trapmaking) is reserved for making complex mechanical traps with DC 20+.

 

[Technik4]

Ridiculousness

As others have said there is nothing wrong with taking a class and not using every little bennie. I see nothing wrong with adding a style or 2 to the new ranger (unarmed is the only one Im really thinking of adding), but not using your style doesnt invalidate your rangerness.

Whats your concept of a ranger? Some aragorn type, wielding a bastard sword or a great sword? The ranger can do that! And the class even allows you to pick up some extra feats (of your choosing) to back you up. Like if you find yourself on a hill defending hobbits against ringwraiths, maybe that 2wf will come in handy with a torch. Or if youre trapped in the mines of moria, shooting orcs as they come through the door, maybe PBS will aid you.

Just because it may be a class feature you dont use all the time doesnt mean its useless. It will be far less useless than "Spell Focus".

The new ranger will lend itself to many different combinations of weapons and armor, 2-weapon fighting and Archery are something the ranger excels at, but it is by no means the limits of their ability. Next youll be complaining about the paladin's warhorse and how he can't take it into the dungeon, or how useless uncanny dodge is to your rogue with maxed initiative who goes first every combat. Or better yet how your bard is upset over some new song he can play, since it seems youll never ever want to use it, because after all, it doesnt fit your character.

Technik

 

[Kae'Yoss]

So why not give the fighter fireballs? After all, he doesn't HAVE to use them

Why not? How could he fight with those? He'd whimper all the time, being good for nothing. And he'll always be interested in adventures that take him to the great clacier, where he can sit in the snow.

Armor proficiency is not comparable to twf or archery.

Armor proficiency is a feat. TWF is a feat. Looks quite comparable to me.

More comparable than the feat TWF and the spell fireball, IMO.

I have yet to see anyone take an armor proficiency feat.

So?

They will always multiclass for the feats.

I disagree.

Like my dm told me when I considered olaying a ranger: "you're not going to fight with two weapons? Then why play a ranger?"

Your DM had no Idea of roleplaying, then. Also, your DM is hardly any authority on the boards here, especially since he hasn't said a word around here.

I'll say it again (for the umpteenth time) No one wants feats they'll never use.

I'll say it again, too: If the rest of the class seems goot to you, and otherwise you'll get nothing, why mind if you get feats you don't use?

That's why fighters never choose spell focus.

You compare apples and oranges here.

And forcing these feats on a ranger who will never use them is tantamount to making a fighter choose spell focus and extra spell as feats. He can always ignore those, can't he?

I'd choose spell focus and extra spell as feats, if that brought me a bigger class skill list, more skill points, and a save against spells.

You pull things out of context: A fighter's only remarkable trait is bonus feats. The ranger is a warrior in the wilderness. Fighters only fight, they're hardly any good at anything else. Rangers fight often, too, but it's not the only thing they do.

And if you don't want to take the ranger class, just stick to the fighter, and don't buy 3.5. Noone'll bother.