Most Awesome Leader? (Warlord!)

[Vayden]

Andre Baptiste Sr.: They say that I am the lord of war, but perhaps it is you.
Yuri Orlov: I believe it's "warlord."
Andre Baptiste Sr.: Thank you, but I prefer it my way.

So, leaving aside rules questions or edition wars for the moment, what do people think is the best leader so far? I define the options as: Tactical Warlord, Inspiring Warlord, Battle Cleric, Lazor Cleric, and Play-test Artificer. So far in play (1-3rd levels) I've seen both Warlord types and the Lazor Cleric in action in different groups, and I've been reading up on the others a bit, though that's not the same as seeing them in action.

From what I've seen so far, the clerics obviously provide the most healing out of them all, but I think the Warlords (particularly the Tactical, but either one) are actually better leaders. The reason for this is that one of the fundamental lessons of D&D still holds true - you win by killing them faster than they kill you, healing doesn't keep up. Of course, when healing is a minor action, it's good and useful to do (and every leader I've seen uses both their words each encounter so far), but being better at damaging monsters wins more than being better at healing.

As leaders, the class is never going to be doing as much sheer damage as the strikers or the striker -lites (Fighters). The Warlords, far more so than their other counterparts, are fantastic at A) increasing the to-hit chance of the dmg-dealers and B) giving the dmg-dealers extra attacks (Commander's Strike at-will FTW). In addition, the movement abilities really fit the feel of 4e and are great at getting the damage boys into a spot where they have combat advantage. The Clerics and the Artificer do all this jazz too, but the Warlords are the kings of the tactical movement/increase dmg output area of the "Leader" tool-set, and that, in my experience, is the best way to win.

In conclusion, everything that makes the Warlords better also slightly applies to the Tactical Warlord over the Inspiring one, making the smart Warlord the true Lord of War!

Everyone else, what are your thoughts? I'm particularly interested in anyone with play experience at Paragon or Epic tiers, and anyone who's actually played the playtest Artificer.

 

[Anguirus]

I've played an Artificer, but only at first level and only in two encounters. They're just as good at healing as Warlords. Unlike the other two, they always want to stay in the back and shoot/distance inspire. I really like Spike Wire (the first level encounter power) but so far it has been more of a minion-clearer than the pseudo-buff it's meant to be.

 

[phil500]

being better at damaging monsters wins more than being better at healing.

I agree with this, thats why I think battle cleric or inspiring warlord are better, because of the at wills righteous brand and furious smash.

at epic, these can easily give +8's left and right. considering that attack bonuses are REALLY hard to come by in 4E, those bonuses are insane for an at-will.

i think the tactical warlords shifty powers are overrated, but that may be just because im new with 4e.

 

[Vayden]

I agree with this, thats why I think battle cleric or inspiring warlord are better, because of the at wills righteous brand and furious smash.

at epic, these can easily give +8's left and right. considering that attack bonuses are REALLY hard to come by in 4E, those bonuses are insane for an at-will.

i think the tactical warlords shifty powers are overrated, but that may be just because im new with 4e.

Furious smash is a very nice buff, but I still think Commander's Strike is better - even if you're not giving a bonus on the to-hit all the time, Commander's Strike gives them an extra attack - in most cases, two attacks is better than a + to hit on one attack. Yes, Furious Smash does a a bit of damage, but it's negligible in comparison to what a striker/fighter can dish out. Still, apples and oranges.

 

[Danceofmasks]

Depends on who the other party members are.

For instance, a str-maxed sword & board fighter can lock down half the battlefield when a tactical warlord is in the house.

Generally speaking, though ... I would have to say laser cleric. The healing is freakishly efficient, action choices and tactics are consistently effective while being almost foolproof.
Less foolproof if built with conjurations & zones, but allows for cheesy stuff like blocking half a corridor .. after all, action denial is king.

 

[Cadfan]

I voted laser cleric. Its less tactical than the warlord options, but there's a lot to be said for just dumping a ton of hit points on an ally in need.

Of course, the other leaders also take damage for the party by acting as defender-lites, so that counts for something too. Its not an obvious call.

 

[Ophidimancer]

Was just looking over Artificer. The level 16 Utility, Good Luck Charm, doesn't seem to have a number or time limit on it, so why wouldn't an Artificer build a huge stockpile of the things?

The effect itself only lasts until the next extended rest, but there is no time limit to the artifice itself.

 

[Goumindong]

Artificer quickly gets broken when it is combined with archmage(easily done by spending a single feat and all its powers are arcane spells). The Healing token as an encounter power means every 5 minutes you can turn 1 healing surge of your own into 2x healing surge value + more.

Now take a dwarf and take durability and dwarven durability and improved second wind. Congrats, now your healing surge value is HP/4+13 and you have 20 surges. In 1 hour you can make 12 of these for HPx3+156 total healing which can be used as a minor action.

Battlecaptain Tactical Warlords are probably still better though(3x encounter minor action +8 to attack and +8 to MOVE! till end of next turn for an ally[technically possible to get this to +10 if you start at 20 int and go demi-god]) there are some pretty cool things insipring warlords can do.

Frankly i don't think Clerics even come close since letting friendlies land the big action denial powers with impunity is simply much much stronger.(E.G. against a solo monster a high int tactical warlord pretty much makes every attack hit 95% of the time, and against smaller ones its just as mean)

 

[Vayden]

Now take a dwarf and take durability and dwarven durability and improved second wind. Congrats, now your healing surge value is HP/4+13 and you have 20 surges. In 1 hour you can make 12 of these for HPx3+156 total healing which can be used as a minor action.

Something tells me that particular feature isn't going to make it out of the "playtest" phase without some modification.

 

[Vendark]

Artificer quickly gets broken when it is combined with archmage(easily done by spending a single feat and all its powers are arcane spells). The Healing token as an encounter power means every 5 minutes you can turn 1 healing surge of your own into 2x healing surge value + more.

Now take a dwarf and take durability and dwarven durability and improved second wind. Congrats, now your healing surge value is HP/4+13 and you have 20 surges. In 1 hour you can make 12 of these for HPx3+156 total healing which can be used as a minor action.

Although it certainly needs clarification, I don't believe Utility powers are intended to count as Daily powers where abilities like the Archmage's are concerned. So Healing Figurine probably isn't meant to be eligible for this.