Mounted PowerAttack with a lance

[Ranger REG]

Easy peasy.

Not really. It was actually Snail-, err I mean Ridley's Cohort that convinced me WHY lance is classified as a two-handed weapon.

However, it still put greatsword at a slight advantage over lance with regards to Spirited Charge: While lance would do triple damage, that's 3d8 (3-24), greatsword at double damage would do 4d6 (4-24).

 

[Felix]

WHY lance is classified as a two-handed weapon.

Hmmm... never thought to ask why it was two handed... I was always satisfied that the lance is basically a spear, and that if you are on foot, it can be used as one. And it takes two hands to use.

But hey, get on a horse, and you can use your armpit to help you hold the thing; that frees up your off hand for something else, eh? Doesn't make the lance smaller though. You're still using your armpit to couch and your primary hand to aim and steady; two body parts are needed, they just happen to be located on the same side of the body.

But that's neither here nor there. All that is just flavor for the very easy rule of:
PA gives 2-for-1 for all two-handed weapons.
Lance: Two-handed weapon.

And that's as simple as it gets.

However, it still put greatsword at a slight advantage over lance with regards to Spirited Charge

For base damage, sure. But at the higher levels base damage is hardly what makes a powerful hit. It's the doubling and trebling of Power Attack, Str bonuses, Enhancements, Smites, etc. that really causes wounds.

 

[Mekabar]

But hey, get on a horse, and you can use your armpit to help you hold the thing; that frees up your off hand for something else, eh? Doesn't make the lance smaller though. You're still using your armpit to couch and your primary hand to aim and steady; two body parts are needed, they just happen to be located on the same side of the body.

Err, I wouldnt advise to do that if you value your armpit. And the corresponding arm for that matter.

 

[Felix]

If I valued any body part highly, I wouldn't be an adventurer.

Err, I wouldnt advise to do that if you value your armpit. And the corresponding arm for that matter.

As you like. Help me out with this then...

You use your hand to stabalize and aim the lance, while your ______ is used as a fulcrum to support the weight of the lance.

But like I said

That's neither here nor there.

Because it's the rules underneath that matter. And "armpits", "upper arms" and "fulcrums" don't change the rules. Tailor your flavor how you like, and let the rules work as written.

 

[Amal Shukup]

If I valued any body part highly, I wouldn't be an adventurer.


As you like. Help me out with this then...

You use your hand to stabalize and aim the lance, while your ______ is used as a fulcrum to support the weight of the lance.

It's gripped (from beneath) with the right hand and clamped tightly against your side by your forearm and elbow. A good foot or two extends behind the lancer's body.

It's also braced (somewhat) across the neck of the horse. This provides some dynamic tension to hold the lance steady between the rider and the horse - not providing a lot along the axis of impact..

More importantly, the lancer is mounted very strongly on the horse using thigh muscles/knees (of course), stirrups and the high cantle (back) of the saddle. Wedged in there good. The lancer leans forward to absorb the blow - ideally transmitting most of the force down through his angled body and into the horse via his seat (not, say, the bridle).

A'Mal

A'Mal

 

[Mekabar]

Yep, that's the way to do it. Much healthier anyway, since there is an artery running through the armpit and getting pieced there or even having the entire arm ripped off is a very, very fatal thing.

 

[Mercule]

I can see the technical argument about the lance getting PA when mounted, but I disagree with the interpretation. As a DM, I wouldn't allow it because I think it's against the spirit of the rules.

If you want to PA with a lance while mounted, I can see two options. The first is to steer with your knees and use your left (assuming a righty) hand to help steady the lance -- i.e. use it like a spear. It'd cause an odd angle and throw off your aim a bit, but it'd give you a bit more leverage and reduce the deflection; which is pretty much how the PA feat reads.

The other is to pull out a historical device that some knights used.

By the late 1300's a small "rest" was mounted to the breastplate of the medieval Knight, to aid the rider in supporting the lance. At this same time, a round "grapper" or ring was placed around the shaft of the lance, behind the hand and ahead of the armpit. The purpose of the grapper was to prevent the lance from sliding back under the arm. When it was used in conjunction with the rest, it served to distribute the force of the impact more evenly across the rider's chest. This had the added advantage of allowing more weight and force to be put directly into the impact. (emphasis added)

If you are that serious about impaling people, then fork out the extra 500 gp for the rest and gripper to grant you the exception to the PA rules.

 

[Felix]

...fork out the extra 500 gp for the rest and gripper to grant you the exception to the PA rules.

No exception needed, but the device illustrates how PA can apply.

...clamped tightly against your side by your forearm and elbow.

So... 6 inches below the armpit, then?

 

[Ranger REG]

But hey, get on a horse, and you can use your armpit to help you hold the thing; that frees up your off hand for something else, eh? Doesn't make the lance smaller though. You're still using your armpit to couch and your primary hand to aim and steady; two body parts are needed, they just happen to be located on the same side of the body.

Perhaps they should be more specific like "two-bodypart-held weapons."

So does that mean if I want to pommel strike my opponent with resting the blade under my armpit while my hand is directing the swing, I gain 2-for-1 PA benefit?

But that's neither here nor there. All that is just flavor for the very easy rule of:
PA gives 2-for-1 for all two-handed weapons.
Lance: Two-handed weapon.

And that's as simple as it gets.

Not really. I initally thought it is two-handed weapon because I have never heard of a one-handed weapon with reach.

 

[Deset Gled]

But what only trumps the DMG? FAQ or errata?

If errata, that means the prestige classes still incur multiclass XP penalty. The errata failed to mention that while the FAQ does.

As per the Primary Source Rule, only official errata can overwrite rules in books. The FAQ can never trump a book. As written, prestige classes incur multiclass penalties, but feel free to rule 0 it.

I initally thought it is two-handed weapon because I have never heard of a one-handed weapon with reach.

A whip.