My conscience stopped me from submitting.

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chatdemon said:
I posted a thread outlining my reasons for not entering a submission a couple weeks ago:

http://test.cyberstreet.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14511

no replies to that one.
funny.
I guess sometimes it is not the post, but the poster that is important, eh?
:confused:

Or, more likely, the title. "The Ghost of Settings Past And Present" doesn't tell me your post has anything to do with the WOTC contest. If your post had been titled "Not Selling My Soul To WOTC" or something, I bet a lot more people would have read it.
 

What Lizard said. Never looked at it until today. I have had the same problem before with some of my own posts.

I run a fan site - A WoT d20. My setting proposal has only slighly impacted the writing for my site (OTOH 13 weeks of bedrest for my wife, a 5 week premature baby, a 4 day hospitalization for my wife 1 week after giving birth, a 20 month old son who doesn't understand any of this and a 17 y/o daughter with "Issues" has greatly impacted the site). In the last week I have done far more work on the site than I spent writing the proposal. They do not have to be exclusive.

But yes, some will get discouraged.
 

You guys and gals shouldn't sell out your ideas to WotC. You took all that time to write and develop. You all would be crazy to send those "labors of love" to the RPG nazis. Don't do it, don't do it, pppplllleeeeaaaasssseeee, for the love of all that is holy, DONT SEND IN YOUR CAMPAIGN SETTINGS!!!!!!
 
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Its a little late to complain now, isn't it? :D

Seriously though, I never understood that "labor of love" thing. Its just a game for goodness sake!
 


I've got to go with RW on this one - I don't get paid enough freelancing to toss my beliefs or the love that I put into my projects aside for the almighty $$ (just ask some of the publishers that have worked with me) :D

I started playing rpgs out of interest and fun and I began writing for them for the same reasons. The day I find myself pimping my work is the day I erase my word processor from my hard drive and never write another word. Does this seem silly to most people? Perhaps, but the only person it has to mean anything to is myself and I like my stance in this regard just fine.
 

Yeah....you're the independant in the world of sell-outs.

Look, creativity is a factor that's as common as dirt in the RPG industry (though you might not know it, looking at some offerings). If you don't want to submit your setting, it's probably not a big deal. WotC is getting stuffloads of people who think probably nearly the same thing about their settings, but who are willing to do what they need to do to get published.

Sure, publish your setting independantly. I'm sure you love it deeply and all, but what makes you think I'll give a fudge? I mean, your setting suffers from the major problems of FR and Greyhawk did before they became popular: "Whoop-dee-friggin'-doo. I can do that myself."

The thing that set apart FR and GH, and even Dragonlance, were the novels. FR was virtually built on the back of two cliches: the Evil One Gone Good, and The Gandalf Wanna-Be. Greyhawk struggles (and still does struggle) with not having any easily marketable goombahs. Dragonlance was constructed as a literary world, carried on the tender lil' backs of Kender and Tinkers.

So, you're gonna produce another one all by yourself? I mean, sure, it's *possible*. But let's face it, D&D books, however successful they are, aren't nessecarily made with love or even skill. It takes something else to get even remotely successful -- something people will buy.

Frankly, I've got enough campaign ideas poppin' outta my head daily. Unless yours as something REAL special, I know I'll pass.

Even if you start as a literary work, whoop-dee-doo. There's a million Ed Greenwood Wannabes filling out the shelves with more than enough literary work and love for "their world."

Maybe I'm a bit bitter, but I'll live and die under the credo: "You're Not Special" To think you are strikes me as hubristic and naive.

I mean, you might be. But spare us the "I love myself too much." speach until *after* you've made some sort of impact. As it is, well, you're lacking in evidence.

And there's always the idea that you don't have to send in your #1 labor of love. Send in #2 or 3, sub-par as they may be. That's what I did, after all, and they have about as much chance as anything else (that is, the nearly-literal one-in-a-million) because even if I think the setting is stupendalicious, there's a fair to medling chance that I'm the only one, or one among a few.

So I'll put it out later. After #2 or 3 is out, and people want to work with me just because my campaign setting was good enough. And if that's #2, imagine what #1 could be like.

Never sell your love short. But don't be affraid to sell the things you just like a lot short.

And as for the chance for Wizards to ruin it...well, that's to be expected, to a certain extent. ^_^ I'll be given preferential treatment on writing stuff, but they'll probably put out crap. No biggie. The important thing is that my art is being appreciated by millions (or maybe just hundreds) of people around the world.

Frankly, that's the most important thing to me. Even if I didn't get paid a penny, I'd be happy to have what I think is a great idea recognized as something worthwhile to thousands of others, and maybe have characters and creatures that I've spent good creative energy on (let's face it, 100 pages is a WHOPPING amount of time and effort to write, and write well) used by other people.

After all, writing is an art, and the purpose of art (beyond anything in human nature) is to entertain, to be appreciated, to have those who see it be made somewhat happier by it.

On the off chance I get chosen and my setting gets run into the ground, I'll still be content knowing that, at least at first, I made something enjoyed by people. Fudge the revenues. That's what's important to me. And if I can't set aside my own hubris long enough to take advantage of an opportunity to maybe get a bit of recognition for my work, I've ultimately accomplished diddly squat. I'm as good as a painter with a remarkable vision he doesn't want to see cheapened by the application to the inferior medium of a canvass.

I work with what I have. What I have is a single page that could, potentially, cause some happiness somewhere down the road. I'm going to jump at it like a starving coyote on a small, unconscious child.

Okay, the analogy is unpleasant. ^_^

Forgive my ramblings, for I am ill and not in my right mind.
 

The best things in life are free, including settings...

RangerWickett said:
...We both plan to work on our worlds for years to come, and though we might not net the same amount of profit, it will be a better labor of love...

...And I realized, I can't let someone have my characters, even some of the most obscure NPCs. I love them too much to let a stranger write them...

...both of our settings have certain traits that would be undesirable to WotC ...

...I might have a chance to have the worlds be famous, but it wouldn't be on my terms...
I completely agree with all of your points and your stance. I have avoided a number of hints and turned down a few direct offers from various 3rd Party groups both in regards to my setting as well working on new material unrelated to my own "labor of love".

Working in a highly technical field (Logistics/Database/GIS Mapping), I understand what happens when something you enjoy becomes your career. Now that computers have stopped being a hobby and become my job, one I'm rather tired of sometimes, I'd rather remain an independant fan-site project. The moment I turn my interest in gaming into a career move, I no longer can design and write the way I enjoy, but must instead look to the market and what is most popular within the current gaming culture and attempt to target that.

No thanks.:(

If my campaign is never played by anyone other than myself and my group (Anyone near Williamsburg/Norfolk, VA? Just moved and could use a few Players...), that is fine by me. It's more important to stay true to my imagination, inspiration and style.

Nay, it's more valuable to do so. Far more valuable than $120K (US).

Chatdemon:
Sorry, I didn't see your post when it went up; Was likely too busy getting ready for my move from Chicago (me+wife+3 kids=a lot of stuff) while working deligently on my home-brew between packing tasks.

;)
 
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A lot of people that have replied to this thread seemed to have lost the plot after the first few posts. Not everyone is interested in pumping out generic gaming material and not everyone who wants to publish is in it for the money. Some do it for love of the game or love of an idea or merely as a fun entrepreneurial outlet. I'm doing my own thing for all of those reasons. Which is why I have a high paying day job. :)
 

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