N00b DM Questions

[carborundum]

Sounds like you're really getting into this
I'm very impressed and over the moon to see someone with so much enthusiasm - it reminds me of me! And as such.. I would like to warn you of a certain trap I fell into.

Once you start writing the player's backstories (as opposed to telling them about the world/ country/ city/ NPCs) then there is a danger that the players are actors in YOUR story. What if they decide to turn their back on the city and go look for the Mother of Pigeons?

Your job is to make, no, to be the world around the players - the adventures they have need to be their own choice. Please don't take my comment as criticism - it's more of a teeny-weeny headsup

Have a great game (and I'm totally stealing that silence breath idea and putting it on a Roper next week!)

 

[Scorponox]

Hi Carborundum, thanks for the complements. The backstory, to me, isn't a huge deal if they don't follow through with it, but gives the players some short term goals, and corresponding rewards.

A mission to find out who is behind the assassin's guild that killed your former captain is better than a random mission that just says "go kill the assassins." It can lead to more interesting story hooks and plots.

Personally, I don't care if they ignore the backstory and just do what they want, but it gives them a history and more emotional investment in the story. For example, if a town or village has been raided by orcs, the adventurers will probably go "oh well, I suppose we should go see what we can do to rescue them". But if the guy's father was there, suddenly there is more urgency to rescue the town. Plus, there are more incentives. Does the guy have a house he used to live in while growing up? Can he ask dad to use the spare room to store all the junk he's accumulated on his journey, possibly as a reward for rescuing the town? Does his dad have a story about orcs and how to fight them better? It can also make for more varied role playing. What if Rouge doesn't care that Fighter's father has been taken by orcs, and wants to explore the cave instead? Will this lead to animosity between the two characters?

Having people they have a pre-adventuring history with, is also more realistic. We all know people in our lives we know and trust. If the adventurers don't have this, they can spend a lot of time on being paranoid and thinking everyone is out to get them. Don't get me wrong - this can be fun also, so why not have a mix?

 

[irdeggman]

I concur with carborundum's caution.

When providing a backstory for a PC you are essentially making the character's class and at least some skills and feat choices.

What I do is provide the setting - background for the world and very broad guidelines for the "types" of characters that fit.

Things like "no evil PCs" are generally a staple in my games.

I then ask each player to provde me with a character history that explains how he became what he is (rough explanation of class, skill and feat choices should be able to be discerned from the write up).

I then provide then xp based on the completeness of the history (and creativity).

I then "tweak" the history somewhat to fit in with the game I'm running. I sometimes insert how 2 PCs know each other, etc. Just things to help them better fit into my overall story arch.

For example I recently ran the Age of Worms.

I told my players that they will be progressing up to epic (or at least near epic) level by the end of the adventure path, that there are a lot of undead as the story progresses, that it is extremely deadly (so some PC deaths should be expected), the city they are starting in, the books allowed to develop characters with.

I told them that they all start out dirt poor and desparate to get out of town and that they need to include something in their history as to how they got that way, if the PC was not from the town originally.


Excerpt from my starting information:


2. Characters start with 1,200 xp (second level plus some). If a character has an item creation feat they can create some items using this xp pool. Subtract any material costs from the starting wealth below. Also, if you want to “convert” some of this xp to starting funds in order to purchase more/better equipment you may do so at a rate of 2gp/xp. You can spend xp such that your character is actually below 1,000 if desired. The character will then be a 1st level character though. During the course of this Adventure path PCs will advance to 20th level (perhaps to epic level depending on how things go and their mortality rate {insert DM evil laugh}).

3. PCs start with 950 gp with which to purchase gear. Standard gear is considered “free”. See later for “standard gear”. The restriction on having no single item worth more than 25% of this amount does not apply. That is, you may spend all of this on a single item, if desired. Spend your money – PCs will be starting with essentially no cash on hand (limited to 10 sp in cash). This is one of the “incentives” for PC involvement in the adventure. Spellcasters that have a spell component pouch (5 gp in the PHB) don’t need to keep track of spell components, except for costly or rare (as in very unique) ones, divine focuses or focuses that wouldn’t fit in the pouch. For initial equipment, everything is available and “book” value. This won’t always be the case, however. Diamond Lake is a “poor” community and stock is limited so don’t always count on being able to buy what you want.

4. Wizards start with an additional 2 spells known per class level (half of the player’s choice and half of mine) reflecting things learned over the past.


13. Write up a character history detailing what made your character the way it is. Include what motivations he/she has and touch on the skill and abilities the character has. Not all skills need to be touched on, but any with high ranks (say 4 or more) should be since the character has obviously placed a lot of emphasis on them. I award an xp bonus for a good write up. This write up serves several purposes. It helps me place the character in the scheme of things, it gives me ways to ensure the PCs are interrelated in some manner, it gives a focus for role-playing and of course it provides the evil DM with built in ways of tormenting the character.

14. PCs can not be of Evil alignment. The adventure path is about an epic struggle against the forces of evil, so an evil PC is quite likely to “change sides” and while that might be fine for the PC it is bad for the story (and other PCs).

 

[Jacob]

As a DM who needs to learn better means of starting a game and progressing a game, I approve this thread. Gotta use some of this stuff. And yeah, that's all I got in the now. Little too blown away to say much else on everyone's know how.

 

[Aran Thule]

Hi there, just a couple of thoughts:
For the octotree remember to put in the stuff for them being a plant, lots of nice defences there.
SRDlant Type - D&D Wiki
I would expect them to be True Neutral from your description.
Given the choking gases description then it sounds like it should be a fort save which should scare the wizards.
As a plus point out to any that fail that they cant communicate with the other players, so no free advise between them.
As trees i would give them damage reduction 5/slashing and fire would do double damage

Possible twists...
If the plant is winning you could have the fairies turn up and call it off, but in compensation the party would have to pay damages or go on a mission.
Rather then have 'bigger' versions of the plants for the ambush you could just have had the fairies prepare them better.
ie:
Use a wand of mage armour on them
pour a potion of fire resistence on them.
Have them be invisible or disguised on on road, otherwise the party could simply avoid them.

Regarding the bird, for roleplay flavour what springs to mind is that it is a far off decendent of the phoenix, thus explaining the renewal properties of its feathers.

As for Jail here is a solution that could work for you.
An adventurer as in a cell does no good for the realm, far better to put a geas on them an send them on a dangerous mission.
Alone they would most likely fail but luckily their companians (charged as associates to the crime) will also go on the mission

Overall i think you have had some great ideas and your players have struck gold in getting you to GM for them, hope it stays great fun

 

[CuRoi]

It's great to see a new DM in the mix! DnD (well any RPG) has always had the problem of too many players, not enough people willing to DM. To me, DMing is the best side of the table and it looks like you are doing some really great work!

On the Octotree - I love it! I'm not sure as a new DM I'd start with building monsters though. Its a pain in the arse really. Each "Type" is sort of like a class in that the type will determine size of HD, Feats, save and BAB progreesion, some special defenses/abilities, etc. etc. That said, if you have a loose off the hip DM style and this works for you and the players then go for it!

Since it is type "plant" I wouldn't use type "animal" creature as a base. Try using a Treant as a base.

Initiative: +0
+2 from Dex right?

Armor Class: 19 (+2 Dex, +7 natural), touch 12, flat-footed 17
Forgot Size Penalty here - 2 for a total of 17

Base Attack/Grapple: +4/+22 (Don't forget Strength and size)
Attacks: Impale 2Arms +12 melee (2d6) (Missing Strength Damage)

Clinging Vine +8 grapple (no damage, but player is held in position.
Grapple is way off for Strength and Size. Should be +4 Base, +10 Strength, +8 Size for a total of +22 Grapple

Your tree needs Feats! : )

Challenge Rating: 6
There isn't a science to this, however the CR rating is a bit low. Look at a Treant - CR 8. It doesn't have near the number of special attacks and such but is similar in size and ability scores. I'd put this thing at 8+ easy.


Anyway, it is such a cool idea, I'm sure you'll figure out a way to make it work in the game.

On the hat - sounds sort of like a Ring of Wizardry or Pearl of Power or somewhere in between, but it is a one shot item. Sort of a tricky thing to price it doesn't fall into the normal formulas. As a one shot item, it should be considerably cheaper.

Two options -Number one do a bunch of Math

Take say a pocket full of Pearls of Power that did all that your hat does might be valued around 7500. However, that just lets you recast spells you already memorized as a Divine caster. So it is limited in two ways but permanent (with once a day use). Pearls of power also have the bonus of not using up an inventory slot (like gloves, rings, boots, hats.) Pearls of Power also need to be used to be activated before you get to cast your recalled spell.

Something that disappears after use yet is usable by any spellcaster and lets you pick the spell? Well, to really "do it right" you need to consider alot of factors and I think we could reverse engineer the pricing behind a Pearl of Power to come up with a base for allowing spell -recall- and then apply that to your hat, giving it a bit of a upcharge since it is any spell.

Number Two
Just guesstimate it - maybe around 1200? Heh.

 

[Scorponox]

Ok, here's another question. Is it considered "cheap" if the DM has certain NPCs have an "anti-sense motive" charm? Like, if Valerie is wearing one, and they do a sense motive, the charm will make her seem like she is always telling the truth? I was thinking of having this, but would this be accessible to well-off people, or do you think it would only be available to the uber-rich and powerful?

Also, how do you fight Charm Person?

 

[steeldragons]

RE: the "anti-sense motive" charm/talisman/what have you. I wouldn't say it's "cheap" for you to do that. Especially if it is someone the PCs will have regular interaction with or is the "big bad".

Joe the farmer...prolllly not gonna have one of these but if magical items (pendants, charms, talismans...put it on a broach or other piece of jewelry) are moderately available, I would say, no harm no foul giving it to someone of a reasonable status (and general "badness")

...and just for "realness" probably someone who does a lot of social interaction/diplomacy type stuff...someone into espionage...who does a lot of double-talk. In which case, I would say it not only negates Sense Motive, but would also screw with Diplomacy, Bluff and naturally "Detect Lie" spells. A "Nondetection" item would almost certainly give the NPC away as "something's up" but a general item of "misdirection" is much more subtle. heh heh. Both, however, I would say are totally in bounds and not "cheap." You are, after all, the DM.

That said, I wouldn't make these things like Lance Armstrong bracelets. But for one person I see absolutely no reason not to use it.

RE: "Fighting Charm Person"...be an elf? Half-elves get some resistance to it as well, IIRC. Otherwise, you have a "anti-sense motive" charm...no reason some enterprising magic-item-making wizard couldn't come up with a similar pendant to ward off a single 1st level spell. The Anti-charm Charm.

Maybe make it charged/limit the uses per day or just period (like, it's usable 5 times then needs to go back to "the shop" to be recharged?). But yeah, easy enough to get around it.

Very simple to explain someone having made something that blocks/negates all Enchantment spells (not just Charm Person)...or any magic for that matter. Especially if you use the specialist schools of magic. The Abjurers school/guild would be an obvious choice...making money by crafting "warding" items.

But again, not the kind of thing you want floating around "easily" available or worn by some random orc brawler. It should be on someone of importance. An amulet against Charm Person would cost $. An amulet to ward off ALL Enchantment magic would cost $$$$ (and might have the bad side effect of "de-magicing"/"suppressing" all of one's magical possessions while it is active? hmm...)

How'd the wood beholder work out? Have you used it yet? What did your players think?

Have fun and happy gaming.
--Steel Dragons

 

[Aran Thule]

Not sure if this fits the description but it sounds like the glibness spell/potion might help.
SRD:Glibness - D&D Wiki

As for charm person, if they were an outsider then that spell wouldnt work on them

 

[CuRoi]

Ok, here's another question. Is it considered "cheap" if the DM has certain NPCs have an "anti-sense motive" charm? Like, if Valerie is wearing one, and they do a sense motive, the charm will make her seem like she is always telling the truth? I was thinking of having this, but would this be accessible to well-off people, or do you think it would only be available to the uber-rich and powerful?

Also, how do you fight Charm Person?

Some good suggestions have already been given. Glibness for instance, or any item that boosts the Bluff skill. If this is a "noble" or "Aristocrat" or some sort of "Expert" socialite, I imagine they alreayd have a very high Bluff to begin with...

It all depends on your campaign as far as how accessible. Going by the typical DnD economy, I'd say it would be something well-off people could own. The boosts to Bluff being fairly accessible and the true Diviniation masking items (for those PCs that are going to use Zone of Truth and the like when they feel that Sense Motive isn't working...) being for the more rich and powerful.

Charm Person - make sure to carefully read the spell description and don't let the players convince you it is some form of mind control. It makes the target think the caster (not necessarily the entire party) is a trusted ally but there are some conditions and possibly future saves involved. As previously mentioned, anything not a "Person" can not be affected so this gives a big range of things that can -look- human/humanoid and the spell will have no effect. Also, make your players actually try to convince the target to do things - a little roleplay never hurt anyone. I'd even give circumstance bonuses/penalties for good or bad roleplay.

Fighting it? Lots of ways -

More obvious
Protection From Evil / Good, Dispel, Minor Globe, Iron Will, Racial abilities, Will Save or Wisdom bonus items. High level casters could maybe have contingency spells against charm effects.

Less Obvious
Charmed Person's allies have crazy high Sense Motive so they can tell something is wrong.

Target has spellcraft and a high bluff. They know what spell was cast on them, made the Will save and are faking the Charm Person until they can use it to their advantage.

Ring of Counterspells - I could see a particularly influential person wearing one with Charm Person loaded...definitely not an everyday counter to the spell though.