Necro is IN! Planned Products

[Horacio]

I guess that if Clark has said that he has spoken witha freelancer and that everything is ok, then everything is ok.

Speacially because Clark IS a lawyer

 

[The_Baldman]

I guess that if Clark has said that he has spoken witha freelancer and that everything is ok, then everything is ok.

Speacially because Clark IS a lawyer

Clark may have spoken with him but I doubt he's seen his NDA nor have I seen his NDA myself. Just saying I doubt that what is happening is cool. Wotc may or may not care that's not my call to make. Just pointing out that what is happening could be legally a problem and I like Necro Games and would hate for something bad to happen to any 3rd party company over something that could have been prevented.

Personally I don't think it's cool or remotely fair myself (though I'm not exactly going to loose sleep over it either). 3rd party publishers should stand or fail on their talent on a level playing field. I guarantee if people found out Paizo has been testing the materials for months now (not saying they have in any fashion - but in the 3rd party company fold they are definetly extremely close to Wotc personal) they would throw a fit about how unfair that would be and how could anybody compete with them at launch. Same thing is happening here. Necromancer Games could put out a product that has twice the work time on it by somebody with twice the experience with 4th edition then any other company at a cost of nothing to themselves (other then the cost to initial use the materials at launch).

 

[Horacio]

Honnestly, and please take no offense, as no offense is intended.

Clark is a lawyer, and a succesful publisher. I guess he cares about his Necro Games even more than you or me (I'm a big fan of them too). So I think that he has already asked himself all those questions, and that if he had decided to go ahead it's because he believes that legally it's o.k., and then I guess that he is right (or at least righter than me or you, suppossing you are not a lawyer and/or publisher).

About if it's fair or not... If it's legal to hire freelancers, any company can do it, so the playing field is levelled, isn't it ?

 

[The_Baldman]

Honnestly, and please take no offense, as no offense is intended.

Clark is a lawyer, and a succesful publisher. I guess he cares about his Necro Games even more than you or me (I'm a big fan of them too). So I think that he has already asked himself all those questions, and that if he had decided to go ahead it's because he believes that legally it's o.k., and then I guess that he is right (or at least righter than me or you, suppossing you are not a lawyer and/or publisher).

About if it's fair or not... If it's legal to hire freelancers, any company can do it, so the playing field is levelled, isn't it ?

No offense taken my friend. It's a game and takes a lot more then that to offend me (for example making me watch the 1st D&D Movie again would fall into that category).

He may very well have asked himself those things or maybe not. I tend not to assume if I can. He may be totally unaware of that clause in the NDA as well. He may be totally aware and totally good and I'm just worrying about nothing. Would rather point it out then watch something bad happen.

 

[Orcus]

If there is a freelancer who has the materials to work on future Wotc products and is also using it to gain an advantage for himself or a 3rd party over somebody else I fully expect bad things to happen to that person and perhaps that company as well. I love the OGL and what it enables 3rd parties to do but they should all be on an even and open playing field. In this case it seems that's not happening.

I dont want this great thread to descend into a legal argument. Who knows what will happen. I would never try to upset WotC on purpose and if I ever did anything to upset them I would absolutely 100% make it right. I have always been a good partner with them and, as a result, I have been trusted in the past with some content such as permission to do the original Tome of Horrors. That said, I dont see a non-compete applying to a process that WotC themselves is creating, releasing and supporting--namely, OGL products. OGL products simply are not competing with WotC. We are all part of the same WotC marketing and promotion web. That is why third party publishing exists--because it helps WotC, not because it hurts WotC. And please know that use of freelancers is very common. Heck, lots of Necro books have been done that way. We dont have massive staffs of in house writers. And on top of that all the freelancers I deal with, and this one in particular, have the utmost professionalism. I would never ask them to see protected content and they would never provide it.

 

[TarionzCousin]

Orclarkcus, I love your attitude and your willingness to gamble your money on these sorts of things. I salute you.

P.S. Eldritch Sorcery is fantastic!

 

[The_Baldman]

I dont want this great thread to descend into a legal argument. Who knows what will happen. I would never try to upset WotC on purpose and if I ever did anything to upset them I would absolutely 100% make it right. I have always been a good partner with them and, as a result, I have been trusted in the past with some content such as permission to do the original Tome of Horrors. That said, I dont see a non-compete applying to a process that WotC themselves is creating, releasing and supporting--namely, OGL products. OGL products simply are not competing with WotC. We are all part of the same WotC marketing and promotion web. That is why third party publishing exists--because it helps WotC, not because it hurts WotC. And please know that use of freelancers is very common. Heck, lots of Necro books have been done that way. We dont have massive staffs of in house writers. And on top of that all the freelancers I deal with, and this one in particular, have the utmost professionalism. I would never ask them to see protected content and they would never provide it.

I am all for keeping this a non-legal arguement (because I'm not a lawyer nor do I even want to pretend to be one).

Wotc has created a process for the new OGL for 4th edition. We all saw it earlier this week and I personally think it's a great idea to boost the initial quality of 4th edition d20 party product and hopefully create a more robust market. I believe the D20 market was severely hurt with the glut of crappy products out of the gate and people stopped being willing to dig through them to find the golden nugget. Most stores stopped stocking them because more then half rotted on the shelf or discount bin.

I know freelancers are used and heck I've been one myself on more then one occassion. I just see using a freelancer who happens to be a 4th edition playtester to work on a project before the OGL is even out or paperwork on the new deal signed is a bit crossing the line. That's my line though. The fact the NDA contains a non-compete and a date furthur stregthens my belief that it's in there for exactly this kind of situation.

 

[Orcus]

Awesome news, Clark! I'll be buying both -- even though I LIKE the directions WotC is taking the game.

You've hit on a good point--you dont have to dislike what WotC is doing to find these products appealing. The APG and Tome 4E will provide you alternatives once the official stuff comes out.

 

[Reynard]

You've hit on a good point--you dont have to dislike what WotC is doing to find these products appealing. The APG and Tome 4E will provide you alternatives once the official stuff comes out.

I have a question: What happens if the terms of the OGL prohibit your intent with the APG? While it seems certain that WotC will think adventures and monster books and settings are great for 4E, they might not think so much of alternate PHBs (and PHB addendum's that contradict the intended design flavor and goals of 4E, anyway). The only chane, at all, that I will purchase 4E is if Necro or another 3rd party manages to get the D&D back in D&D. if WotC decides that is against their best interests and includes provisions to, say, not allow publishers to create "new" missing stuff until it appears in a WotC book and gets added to the SRD, will Necro still jump on board?

(Note: I realize the new OGL will be under NDA -- a fact that concerns me to no end, BTW -- but I assume you cna answer the above questions witout breaking said NDA.)

 

[drothgery]

I know freelancers are used and heck I've been one myself on more then one occassion. I just see using a freelancer who happens to be a 4th edition playtester to work on a project before the OGL is even out or paperwork on the new deal signed is a bit crossing the line. That's my line though. The fact the NDA contains a non-compete and a date furthur stregthens my belief that it's in there for exactly this kind of situation.

Err... I suspect Ari has pre-release copies of the 4e rules because he's also a WotC freelancer (I've got a few WotC books at home with Ari's name on the cover), and working on WotC 4e products right now, not because he's a playtester. And as such the NDA he's signed is probably quite different than the one a playtester would sign.