Need quick Book of Nine Swords multi-classes help

[RigaMortus2]

Page 40, "End of the Encounter". It's a paragraph on the left-hand side.

Cheers, -- N

But considering the Crusader does not have any granted manuevers until combat begins, I don't think it would be available for them outside of combat.

 

[Nifft]

@ Kmart Kommando: I dislike using that word in this context. Technically the maneuvers "are recovered", but the character does not take the Recovery action. This is only an important distinction of the character has the Vital Recovery feat, but since that feat triggers per encounter, I dislike anything allowing its use between encounters.

I don't think that "reset" implies "re-choose", but let me explicitly agree that no, re-choosing is NOT an automatic per-minute benefit, and takes 5 minutes or the Adaptive Style feat, just like you've said.

But considering the Crusader does not have any granted manuevers until combat begins, I don't think it would be available for them outside of combat.

The Crusader doesn't have any Withheld maneuvers outside of combat, either. He's just got Readied and Expended.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Henry]

@ Kmart Kommando: I dislike using that word in this context. Technically the maneuvers "are recovered", but the character does not take the Recovery action. This is only an important distinction of the character has the Vital Recovery feat, but since that feat triggers per encounter, I dislike anything allowing its use between encounters.

I don't think that "reset" implies "re-choose", but let me explicitly agree that no, re-choosing is NOT an automatic per-minute benefit, and takes 5 minutes or the Adaptive Style feat, just like you've said.

The Crusader doesn't have any Withheld maneuvers outside of combat, either. He's just got Readied and Expended.

Cheers, -- N

That's the way my DM has been letting me use them. Once per 5 minutes for the line of sight 50-ft teleport is not unbalanced, in our opinion.

Thanks for the help, all!

 

[Hyperfist]

Thanks to you both! I came to the same conclusion after sifting through the FAQ after this post, but wanted to be sure. (Doing a find for "maneuver" takes a little while in that doc.)

I'm still a bit iffy on how Martial Study plays into it. I took "Shadow Jaunt" with my martial study feat back at 6th level, and I'm assuming it's still in my Crusader "rotation" rather than being usable with my Warblade stuff, but the Martial Study feat is very unwieldy in its description, IMO.

When using a Martial Study feat, that maneuver is outside of either Martial adept class and renewal methods. That maneuver is only usable once per encounter. Just like only Crusader maneuvers are renewed by the Crusader Mechanics and the Warblade are renewed by Warblade mechanics.


And that Martial Study feat maneuver is readied regardless of what your maxes in your Martial Adept class. At least until it is expended.

 

[RigaMortus2]

And that Martial Study feat maneuver is readied regardless of what your maxes in your Martial Adept class. At least until it is expended.

I don't have the book on me atm, but I don't *think* the maneuver you pick from Martial Study is automatically Readied (unless you are a non-martial adept, like a Fighter for example). I beleive you still have to ready the maneuver.

Kinda like if a Wizard adds a new spell to their spellbook, they still have to prepare it if they want to cast it.

 

[Hyperfist]

Yep....your right. Just took a look at it now.

 

[Henry]

When using a Martial Study feat, that maneuver is outside of either Martial adept class and renewal methods. That maneuver is only usable once per encounter. Just like only Crusader maneuvers are renewed by the Crusader Mechanics and the Warblade are renewed by Warblade mechanics.


And that Martial Study feat maneuver is readied regardless of what your maxes in your Martial Adept class. At least until it is expended.

And this is why I say that feat is written badly.

MARTIAL STUDY
Benefit: When you gain this feat, you must choose a discipline of martial maneuvers, such as Desert Wind. The key skill for the chosen discipline becomes a class skill for all your classes (current and future). Select any maneuver from the chosen discipline for which you meet the prerequisite. If you have martial adept levels this maneuver becomes one of your maneuvers known. If you do not have martial adept levels, you can use this maneuver once per encounter as a martial adept with an initiator level equal to 1/2 your character level. If you do not have martial adept levels when you take this feat, and you later gain a level in a class that grants maneuvers known, these new maneuvers can be used only once per encounter and have no recovery method. If you later gain levels in a martial adept class (crusader, swordsage, or warblade), you use the recovery method for maneuvers learned as a result of those class levels, but your previous maneuvers (gained through this feat or through prestige class levels) do not gain a recovery method.

A maneuver learned through this feat cannot be exchanged for a different maneuver if you are a crusader, swordsage, or warblade. Once you choose a maneuver with this feat, you cannot change it.

From what I read, if you have a Martial Adept class when you take the feat, then it goes into your regular list of maneuvers, becomes "known." and then it goes into all this detail about what happens if you DON'T have MA levels. So if my Crusader took Shadow Jaunt with this, shouldn't they go into "rotation" with the rest of them?

 

[blargney the second]

So if my Crusader took Shadow Jaunt with this, shouldn't they go into "rotation" with the rest of them?

That's my understanding, Henry.
-blarg

 

[Nifft]

From what I read, if you have a Martial Adept class when you take the feat, then it goes into your regular list of maneuvers, becomes "known."

That's how I read it as well.

If you already have Martial Adept levels, you must Ready your new maneuver (5 minutes, or Adaptive Style); then you can use it in combat as usual, or 1/minute out of combat.

If you don't have Martial Adept levels when you take the feat (and this is why it's a bad feat, depending on state is a bad thing), then you can use it 1/encounter, or 1/minute out of combat.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Three_Haligonians]

What kills me is that if you don't have Martial Adept levels when you take it, at say 6th level, then when you pick one up at level 9... it doesn't transfer over.. it is stuck.

Makes things complicated

J from Three Haligonians