Need some clarification on tanglefoot bags

[Stalker0]

Alright, its time I nailed down this question that's been nagging at me.

From what I've always read, tanglefoot bags give a reflex save to avoid being immobilized on the ground. HOWEVER, regardless of failing or passing, the opponent is still entangled for the 10 min until it wears off.

Is that actual, or does the save apply to both, b/c honestly that makes tangles damn powerful no matter what level you are.

Also, freedom of movement does not help against tanglefoot bags, is that right?

 

[Pax]

You're right EXCEPT for the last sentence; Freedom Of Movement shoudl protect you form the restrictions on your momevement reflected by the entanglement of the Tanglefoot Bag.

 

[Stalker0]

The spell description says it only applies to magic that impedes movement. it gives water as an exception, but says nothing about nonmagical impedition.

 

[Cheiromancer]

Tanglefoot bags are a puzzle to me too.

Is there a size limitation? It seems improbable that Tarrasques and Great Wyrms can be hindered by a single bag of the stuff.

 

[Catalyst]

Just responding to keep this thread lively, as I too am wondering if there's been a ruling on size restrictions. My players used them on a behir (40' long, the tanglefoot bag only affects a 5' square, right??).

 

[jgbrowning]

dont use them

i dont use them.

stupid items, with ill thought out consequences, and ill defined effects.

joe b.

 

[Crothian]

I think the DM has to use some common sense with this item. With large and bigger creatures and with creatures that are multi legged and long, I as a DM would allow some pretty hefty circumstance modifiers for the potential victim. At the same time targets that are tiny and smaller would have a much more difficult time.

 

[Crothian]

Re: dont use them

i dont use them.

stupid items, with ill thought out consequences, and ill defined effects.

joe b.

Care to eloborate?

 

[jgbrowning]

Re: Re: dont use them

Care to eloborate?

sure

1. if you hit, its make any creature move at 1/2 speed. not quite as good as a slow spell but, hey, it only costs 50gp.

2. its a ranged touch attack. you'll amost always hit.

3. it never mentions size in the discription, so by default yes, it entangles ALL oppenants. (although i dont think they ment it too nor does it make sense) Anything that everyone house rules needs to be fixed... like HARM/HEAL.. hopefully they'll do that as well.

4. it just seems, IMHO along with all the other alchemical stuff, to be there because there had to be something to do with alchemy skill *** i mean come on.. to make something like a sunrod would minimally require someone with an alchemy bonus of +5 and really would require something more like a +10. to find an expert in a city with alchemy skill of an appropirate level would be HARDER than finding a 3rd level cleric to just make an everburning torch. (a little more than 50% of all small towns would have such a cleric) and who would take the alchemy skill anyway really since all you can do is make acid at DC 15? how would they make money with the skill? ok.. ok.. this in another rant entirely ****

whew.. tired...

joe b.

 

[Cheiromancer]

Does no-one else have a problem with Tanglefoot bags? Do your players use them a lot?

The rules as written just seem to offer skimpy guidance, that's all, to what I think would be some common circumstances.