Need to negate Force-type damage & Disintegrate.

[thorian]

For disintegration, you can add the armor/shield enhancement of protection against transmutation. It is a +6 enhancement, so it is a little expensive. I can't remember which book it is from, either DotF or Arms & Equip, I think.

 

[Hardhead]

Things from Mind's Eye aren't balanced - and often aren't even parsable by speakers of English who are fluent in the game mechanics of D&D.

If you run into something from ME that seems like the author took a flying leap off the sanity trellice and is so far into Crazy Town that he's the Mayor - that's probably exactly what happened. Prospective authors for Mind's Eye are all given the keys to a 1984 robbin's egg blue Buick Skylark and a 5 liter jug of 1M dexedrine solution along with a map of Crazy Town with unlabled streets. If you take the stuff that they come back with literally you will be in a lot of trouble.

It's from Mindscapes, not Mind's Eye.

Also, thanks for the help everyone.

 

[Piratecat]

Frank, that's certainly an evocative image, but you're stating a personal opinion as an unequivocal fact - and that's usually dangerous. Anyways, it's from a completely different source, and the PrC that it stems from is quite well balanced.

 

[FrankTrollman]

Frank, that's certainly an evocative image, but you're stating a personal opinion as an unequivocal fact - and that's usually dangerous. Anyways, it's from a completely different source, and the PrC that it stems from is quite well balanced.

If the class gives you an unlimited number of lesser yous, each of whom could potentially be powerful enough to in turn make an unlimited number of lesser yous in turn - then the class is obviously not well balanced.

It's like sticking a sticker on free Simulacrum and calling it balanced. It wasn't balanced to begin with - so why would it be balanced for free?

Or to put it another way - the higher level you are, the better Mind Seed is on an absolute scale, and on a relative scale. When you are 16th level, the duplicates are half your level and when you are 20th level the duplicates are 60% of your level - and so on.

Meanwhile, the absolute cost of the ability goes down in relation to what else you can spend XP on. Namely, that when you are 16th level, 3k is almost 18.75% of the cost of a level - when you are 20th level, 3k is only 15% of the cost of a level. So at the limit of infinite level gain - Mind Seed's cost is approaching neglibilty while the power of the duplicate relative to the caster is approaching 1.

So Mindseed was already eventually unbalanced. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow - but soon. And for the rest of your life. Mindseed for free is just absurd. It's unbalanced right now.

-Frank

 

[jmucchiello]

So Mindseed was already eventually unbalanced. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow - but soon. And for the rest of your life. Mindseed for free is just absurd. It's unbalanced right now.

I have to agree. If Mindseed requires an XP cost to manifest how in the world is it "balanced" to include it as a random effect in some other power that does not have an XP cost to manifest? Also, mind seed and microcosm normally cost 15 or 17 PP to manifest. This power only costs 9 to manifest and effects multiple targets. I'd ask Bruce if he's got any suggested errata for this one because it sounds out of whack.

 

[daTim]

Well, you can become immune to transmutation (spells like polymorph and disentegration) by taking the "Entropist" prestige class from Lords of Darkness FR book. Their first level ability "Sanctity of Body" protects them from anything that would alter their body in some way, even a sphere of annihilation! Keep in mind you have to join their organization.

 

[drnuncheon]

I have to agree. If Mindseed requires an XP cost to manifest how in the world is it "balanced" to include it as a random effect in some other power that does not have an XP cost to manifest?

Well, because it's not repeatable, and as Hardhead is finding out, you can't use it in the same way as you would the regular Mind Seed power. You can't count on it, which puts huge limits on it - you can't choose who you're going to use it on or when you want to use it with any certainty. For a power like mind seed, that takes away 90% of its utility.

J

 

[CRGreathouse]

Or to put it another way - the higher level you are, the better Mind Seed is on an absolute scale, and on a relative scale. When you are 16th level, the duplicates are half your level and when you are 20th level the duplicates are 60% of your level - and so on.

Nah, the duplicates are always 1/16th your power because of the power scale of CR.

 

[AuraSeer]

Anyways, it's from a completely different source, and the PrC that it stems from is quite well balanced.

Don't you mean it's otherwise well balanced? This one feature is clearly unbalancing, by any measure.

In effect the ability grants an unlimited number of cohorts, with a one-week delay. Walk into a 60-person village, zap some peasants, and seven days later you have 10 new selves. If you want a larger army, just find another village. You don't even have to wait around for the transformation to take place; either come back in a week to collect the dupes, or simply trust that they can find you on their own.

All that with no XP cost? That alone makes the class b0rken. The ability's usefulness in combat is just gravy.

 

[Hardhead]

Meanwhile, the absolute cost of the ability goes down in relation to what else you can spend XP on. Namely, that when you are 16th level, 3k is almost 18.75% of the cost of a level - when you are 20th level, 3k is only 15% of the cost of a level. So at the limit of infinite level gain - Mind Seed's cost is approaching neglibilty while the power of the duplicate relative to the caster is approaching 1.

So Mindseed was already eventually unbalanced. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow - but soon. And for the rest of your life.

Mind Seed, on it's own, doesn't get unbalanced until well into Epic progression, I think. Understandable, since the Epic Handbook wasn't even being considered when the Psi Handbook was written. And, let's be honest, a *lot* of stuff breaks down when you get into Epic levels.

Mindseed for free is just absurd. It's unbalanced right now.

It's a pretty inefficient way to do it, though. You've got to kill off about three people for every copy that comes out. If you're a PC, you're probably good, and you wouldn't want to do that. If you're an evil PC, adventurers are going to come looking for you if your copies don't stage a coup first (your copies are *not* cohorts. If you're an evil, selfish bastard, then so are your copies - and you shouldn't expect cooperation from *them*!). If you're an NPC Evil Guy, it's a great adventure idea. So, nah, I don't think it's unbalanced.


Someone else said:

I have to agree. If Mindseed requires an XP cost to manifest how in the world is it "balanced" to include it as a random effect in some other power that does not have an XP cost to manifest? Also, mind seed and microcosm normally cost 15 or 17 PP to manifest. This power only costs 9 to manifest and effects multiple targets. I'd ask Bruce if he's got any suggested errata for this one because it sounds out of whack.

The Microcosm of the Prismatic Burst ability grants a save, unlike the normal Microcosm. Sot it's considerably weaker.