D&D (2024) (+) New Edition Changes for Inclusivity (discuss possibilities)

[Haldrik]

IMO we are still many years away from a 6e, so I’m not surprised this discussion has been consumed by other topics tangential to that topic.

At the moment, I remain less interested in 6e until any difficulties with 5e are more fully understood. For example, I want 6e to get ability scores right, but that seems to still be a work in progress.

In the meantime, being more inclusive of reallife identity groups and touching on reallife worldviews that relate to identity groups, is immediately relevant to 5e too.

 

[Haldrik]

What is your point?

The change required active work over the last decade. It required getting in peoples face. It required allies telling their homophobic friends and family that their homophobia was gross and wrong.

Your “seeds” theory doesn’t change that.

To "harvest" takes effort too.

 

[Azzy]

It's also about the idea that there are all powerful evils waiting out there, too horrible and unthinkable for us to comprehend, that could wipe us all out at a moments notice. A truth of which the mere realization would drive a man to insanity or suicide. We live in blissful ignorance of these waking nightmares.

Meh, I lived through the Cold War with the threat of nuclear annihilation. I also realize that we're one meteor away from extinction. Also, that climate change will have great impact on the future and that the human race is doing very little to address that issues. We're living in a pandemic, my mother is elderlyy, my brother is on oxygen, I have high blood pressure, too many people in my community are not behaving with concern, and my local and state government is doing a poor job of handling this crisis. There's also a multitude of other issues that I could list (if I cared enough to expend the effort—I've been out in the Florida sun all day, trying to avoid having a heat stroke so right now I can't be arsed to care—sorry), but I think you get the basic point. We are living with very real existential threats already and there are many people just pretend it doesn't affect them or that it's not their problem. Much of this sort of thing has driven some to depression, anxiety, and suicide. So, powerful cosmic evils? Whatever. Get in line, Cthulhu.

Also, as someone that actually suffers from a mental illness, the talk of madness and insanity makes me roll my eyes as it's very primitive, uninformed, and (unwittingly) reinforces some bad ideas and stigmas about mental health issues.

P.S. — Sorry if I come across cranky, working outside during this heat is not fun.

 

[Levistus's_Leviathan]

For inclusivity I'd go with 15 classes: 5 power sources and 3 classes in each

1. Arcane
   1. Sorcerer
   2. Warlock
   3. Wizard
2. Divine
   1. Avenger
   2. Cleric
   3. "Paladin"
3. Martial
   1. Champion(Barbarian)
   2. Fighter
   3. Hero
4. Nature/Primal
   1. Druid
   2. Ranger
   3. Shaman or Warden
5. Skill
   1. Bard
   2. Noble
   3. Rogue

This creates a class for each playstyle gimmick without a need for feat chains or power systems that confuse new players or turn off roleplayers.

No artificer or psion? I think WotC could save a lot of trouble next time they're making Eberron be a setting in the next edition by having the Artificer be a base class.

 

[Minigiant]

My idea a bit not fleshed out.

There are four classes: warrior, cleric, rogue, mage. These classes set some basic options: HD, spellcasting progress, saves, basic proficiencies. Each class gives a pool of points to buy class features with. These features include weapon/armor proficiencies, abilities like rage, smite, turn undead, metamagic, etc. Some abilities have prerequisites like level or other abilities you need first, but if you belong to that class, you can spend your points to buy your classes abilitiesn. You can also poach off the other classes lists, but they cost more points than if you were a member of the normal class. So if your a warrior and want to pick up some spells to be an EK, it would cost you more to learn magic then if you were a mage. Some basic abilities are reprinted for multiple class lists as well.

Warriors are the primary fighting type; d10 HD, Proficient in all weapons and light/medium armor. Some of the themes provide include Fighter, Battlerager, Oathsworn, Eldritch Knight, and Marshal. You can follow the theme or do you own thing.

For Rogue, you have d8 HD and a large selection of skills to be proficient in. You can buy a lot of skill-based abilities as well as skirmish and flashy abilities. The Thief, Bard, Assassin, Ranger, and Martial Artist are options.

Mages can select Intelligence or Charisma as a casting stat and initially select either Arcane (elemental/combat magic) or Mesmerism (enchantment/illusion) spell lists. Mages can represent Wizards, Sorcerers, Beguilers, and Artificers.

Clerics are primarily priest role who can pick Wisdom or Charisma as a casting stat and pick from Divine (healing) or Primal (buffing/summoning) magic. Most options here are focused on domains to represent Life, Nature, Trickery or War, but the Shapeshifter Spiritwalker, and Pactbound reside here to.

As the game grows, new archetypes with new abilities get added to the core classes. Eventually, a fifth class (psionicist) could be added.
.

Well the point was to make inclusive names and class features for the classes.

The goal is to

1. Create a generic form of the Barbarian and convert the Barbarian and Berserker to subclasses in other to be inclusive to other types of "Wild Warriors" around the world. I suggested that the class be changed to the Champion and simply get Super Mode
   1. The Barbarian would get Rage
   2. The Berserker would get Frenzy
   3. The Zealot would get Zeal
   4. The Madman would get Madness
   5. Totem Warrior would get Spirit Trance
2. Create more Priest types to incorporate priests from other parts of Earth in fantasy forms.
   1. The Cleric would remain as a fantasy representative of fantasy analogs of Abrahamic organized religion structures.
      1. They would get divine spellcaster role
      2. Clerics would choose between Divine Channeling, Runecasting, or Divine Covenant
   2. The Druid would take the nature spellcaster role and represent religions that revere nature
      1. The Druid would get it's own spell list
      2. Druid would choose between Wildshape, Primal Wrath, and Beast Companion.
   3. The Shaman would get the spiti caster role and represent spirit based religion from Mongolian shaman, Shinto priest, witch doctors, and medicine men
      1. The Shaman would choose between Spirit Companion, Seeker Bond (seekers are now shamans because Kikyo), or Vestige Binding

Only issue is where to put MesoAmerican priests? Aztec and Maya priests would need representation.

 

[Azzy]

No artificer or psion? I think WotC could save a lot of trouble next time they're making Eberron be a setting in the next edition by having the Artificer be a base class.

But what other meaty mechanics would you put into it to entice people that aren't interested in Eberron to buy it? /cynicism

 

[Levistus's_Leviathan]

But what other meaty mechanics would you put into it to entice people that aren't interested in Eberron to buy it? /cynicism

The races and mechanics and descriptions of the world would still be in an eberron setting book, along with setting specific magic items, subclasses, and monsters.

 

[Minigiant]

No artificer or psion? I think WotC could save a lot of trouble next time they're making Eberron be a setting in the next edition by having the Artificer be a base class.

They would be used to sell Eberron and Dark Sun

 

[Levistus's_Leviathan]

They would be used to sell Eberron and Dark Sun

Do you think those books wouldn't sell without those classes in them?

 

[Minigiant]

Do you think those books wouldn't sell without those classes in them?

Not as well.
Not well enough for modern corporate standards anyway.