D&D (2024) New Unearthed Arcana Playtest Includes Barbarian, Druid, and Monk

The latest Unearthed Arcana playtest packet is now live with new barbarian, druid, and monk versions, as well as new spells and weapons, and a revised Ability Score Improvement feat.

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WHATS INSIDE

Here are the new and revised elements in this article:

Classes. Three classes are here: Barbarian, Druid, and Monk. Each one includes one subclass: Path of the World Tree (Barbarian), Circle of the Moon (Druid), and Warrior of the Hand (Monk).

Spells. New and revised spells are included.

The following sections were introduced in a previous article and are provided here for reference:

Weapons. Weapon revisions are included.

Feats. This includes a revised version of Ability Score Improvement.

Rules Glossary. The rules glossary includes the few rules that have revised definitions in the playtest. In this document, any underlined term in the body text appears in the glossary.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Which is a fine house rule, but it's not how I play it. I follow RAW where no roll is had unless the outcome is in doubt, and that's not going to change or I wouldn't have had a roll in the first place.

You know that this is not RAW.
There are situations where you can try a roll and the cost of a failed roll is not that you can't do it, but it just takes more time.

Check to open the lock? Fail? Sorry, you can't catch the thief before they get away, but you can still enter the room through the exact door. But a few seconds to late.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Specific beats general. The specific grapple rules do that. As do specific spells which allow saves every round. The general rule, though, is that ability checks are not rolled for unless the outcome(end result) is in doubt.

Why would I deny a Specific Beats General situation? The grapple rules, unlike the ability check rules in the PHB, specifically allow multiple checks.

There is nothing specific about the roper ability. No retry is specifically allowed.

Other checks might allow for a check every round. But for the roper example: nothing that allows it. Only: one action and done.

Edit: it is not the escape DC but the DC for someone breaking the Tendril. But that does not change the point.

 

[Maxperson]

Oh. And circumstances can change without magic... this is called: take a step back and stop trying to do something with haste.

Why would you assume that someone trying to pick a lock is rushing when there's no reason for them to rush in the game? And if there is a reason to rush in the game, there's no time to step back and stop rushing.

Did you never try to jump hastily over something 20 cm high and triped because you wanted to reach the bus? Then you just take your time jump over it and take the next which sadly takes 15 minutes more to take you home?

So there were two things going on there that aren't assumed to be in play in a general discussion about how ability checks work.

First, circumstances that force rushing. Second, a meaningful consequence for failure. The first made the outcome of "Making it in time to reach the bus" in doubt, so a roll was called for. The latter follows the DMG guidelines for calling for a roll.

Absent the rush, say if I saw the bus was far enough that I had plenty of time even if I didn't make it the first time I would still be able to catch the bus, there would be no roll. I would just succeed without and get into the bus.

 

[Maxperson]

You know that this is not RAW.
There are situations where you can try a roll and the cost of a failed roll is not that you can't do it, but it just takes more time.

I showed it to you. Here it is again from the only ability check rules in the core books. PHB page 174

"The DM calls for an ability check when a character or monster attempts an action (other than an attack) that has a chance of failure. When the outcome is uncertain, the dice determine the results."

The outcome is the end result. It's what happens when all is said and done. If after a failed roll the outcome would be certain success, then the outcome was never uncertain and no roll is called for by RAW.

Check to open the lock? Fail? Sorry, you can't catch the thief before they get away, but you can still enter the room through the exact door. But a few seconds to late.

There are no rules that say this in the ability check rules. It's a fine house rule, but it is a house rule. It is also covered in the DMG guidelines under the success at a cost portion where if you fail the roll by a little bit, the DM can have you succeed at a cost.

 

[Maxperson]

There is nothing specific about the roper ability. No retry is specifically allowed.

Other checks might allow for a check every round. But for the roper example: nothing that allows it. Only: one action and done.

Edit: it is not the escape DC but the DC for someone breaking the Tendril. But that does not change the point.

It is a specific exception in the roper ability. You get to take an action to attempt to break it and you get an action every round.

Round 1: "I am in Grasping Tendrils so I'm using my action to try and escape."
Round 2: "My roll failed last round, but since I am allowed to take an action to try and escape, I will do so again."

There is no such language in the general ability check rules in the PHB. The roper ability is a case of specific beats general.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I showed it to you. Here it is again from the only ability check rules in the core books. PHB page 174

"The DM calls for an ability check when a character or monster attempts an action (other than an attack) that has a chance of failure. When the outcome is uncertain, the dice determine the results."

That can change from round to round. You can ask for a check and then you can go for the lesser success. Why should you be stuck behind an easy lock?

The outcome is the end result. It's what happens when all is said and done. If after a failed roll the outcome would be certain success, then the outcome was never uncertain and no roll is called for by RAW.

There can be different end results depending on the first or second or third check.

There are no rules that say this in the ability check rules. It's a fine house rule, but it is a house rule. It is also covered in the DMG guidelines under the success at a cost portion where if you fail the roll by a little bit, the DM can have you succeed at a cost.

That is no house rule. Yours seems to be. After failing one roll against a DC10 lock, you are forbidden to ever try it again.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Why would you assume that someone trying to pick a lock is rushing when there's no reason for them to rush in the game? And if there is a reason to rush in the game, there's no time to step back and stop rushing.

I explained the situation. There can be reasons to rush at first and then after that failed, do it the normal way.

So there were two things going on there that aren't assumed to be in play in a general discussion about how ability checks work.

First, circumstances that force rushing. Second, a meaningful consequence for failure. The first made the outcome of "Making it in time to reach the bus" in doubt, so a roll was called for. The latter follows the DMG guidelines for calling for a roll.

Yes. Make a roll. Get over that damned 20cm wall fast enough.

Absent the rush, say if I saw the bus was far enough that I had plenty of time even if I didn't make it the first time I would still be able to catch the bus, there would be no roll.

Yes. But that was noth the situation. You really need to make that easy jump to catch exactly this bus. And you tripped.

I would just succeed without and get into the bus.

No, you would not. You tumble and hurt yourself. Then you go back and take your time and just jump over that damned wall, which you now find easy. And then you take the next bus 15 minutes later.

With your house ruling: you may never again try to jump over that wall, as it has proven to be beyond your abilities.

Just go to the next playground and watch a few 3 years old doing exactly this. Running. Tripping. Trying again.

If everyone stops doing something because they tripped up the first time, then there would be no progress ever.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

It is a specific exception in the roper ability. You get to take an action to attempt to break it and you get an action every round.

Round 1: "I am in Grasping Tendrils so I'm using my action to try and escape."
Round 2: "My roll failed last round, but since I am allowed to take an action to try and escape, I will do so again."

So I was allowed to open the lock last time, I can now use my action to rry to open it again...

There is no such language in the general ability check rules in the PHB. The roper ability is a case of specific beats general.

That is totally made up.

 

[Maxperson]

That can change from round to round. You can ask for a check and then you can go for the lesser success. Why should you be stuck behind an easy lock?

Why would an expert roll for an easy lock?

If it can change from round to round, that's an argument to roll for literally everything. Everything can change from round to round. It's a shoo in, nope since it's possible to sneeze and fail, you need to roll.

5e simplifies thing. If the outcome(ultimate end result) is not in doubt, there is no roll. If it is in doubt, then you roll.

Now there can be corner case scenarios where you ordinarily would not have to roll, but something is pressuring you right now and so you roll. But that happens because there is a meaningful consequence for failure(the time pressure event happens before you can succeed). If you later come back to that lock(or whatever caused the check) and the pressure is not present, there would be no need for you to roll. But that's a corner case event, not the way things normally happen. In short, it's a case of specific beats general. The specific circumstances have forced a roll when the outcome would not ordinarily be in doubt.

For a lock with no such specific circumstances, there is no roll at all by RAW if the outcome is not in doubt. And if, with all the time in the world, the outcome(ultimate end result) is in doubt, then there should be no retry or autosuccess if you fail the roll. RAW does not allow for that since autosuccess would have precluded the first roll and the one roll is to determine the ultimate outcome of what you are trying to accomplish.

Now the DMG guidelines do offer up advice to the DM that he can allow retries or rule retries impossible, and that advice applies to locks as much as any other ability check. How you would take that advice does not have to be how I would take that advice. Both ruling the lock retriable and impossible to attempt a second time fall within that DMG guidance.

 

[Maxperson]

That is totally made up.

Is not.

"This book contains rules, especially in parts 2 and 3, that govern how the game plays. That said, many racial traits, class features, spells, magic items, monster abilities, and other game elements break the general rules in some way, creating an exception to how the rest of the game works."

You can use your action, and you get one every round, to overcome that monster ability.