[News] Role-player decapitated (drug addicts arrested)
- Thread starter Frostmarrow
- Start date
Larry Fitz
First Post
Mark brings up an interesting point, one that combined with a previous question "What will we, as a community, do about this?" leads me to ask, if someone killed a gamer, shouldn't we be more interested in finding out who and having them brought to justice? I'm not talking about anyone doing anything silly, like donning a trenchcoat and heading to Sweden, but what about a modest reward? Any interest in doing something like that? If we as a community respond in positive way, wouldn't that be newsworthy as well? More importantly, might it help bring the muderer(s) to justice?
Mordane76
First Post
I'm not worried about bad press for the game, Mark. I'm more worried about bad press for the people involved in the game. I'm worried about the witch-hunt attitude that people get when they hear about our hobby.
No, none of the people I game with are fringe-community outsiders, but that's the stereotype associated with gamers. Perhaps I wasn't clear ---> this is the perception people have about us. Even in college towns, where one would expect a little bit more enlightened thought, we're still considered to be the gateway to Satanism and debauchery. I've had to deal with this idea about our subculture I don't know how many times, and frankly I'm a little sick of it. So forgive me if I seem a bit "incessant, woe-is-me, why- can't-the-world-just-accept-me," but I've seen it happen before.
As for the "positive response" from the gaming community, it's a nice gesture, but it's by no means newsworthy. Which gets better ratings ---> nicety-nice gamers trying to bring the criminal to justice, or painting a whole subculture as shiftless and dangerous?
Not that I don't agree with the idea, but what's a good figure to offer as a reward, and how would we go about setting up such a program?
No, none of the people I game with are fringe-community outsiders, but that's the stereotype associated with gamers. Perhaps I wasn't clear ---> this is the perception people have about us. Even in college towns, where one would expect a little bit more enlightened thought, we're still considered to be the gateway to Satanism and debauchery. I've had to deal with this idea about our subculture I don't know how many times, and frankly I'm a little sick of it. So forgive me if I seem a bit "incessant, woe-is-me, why- can't-the-world-just-accept-me," but I've seen it happen before.
As for the "positive response" from the gaming community, it's a nice gesture, but it's by no means newsworthy. Which gets better ratings ---> nicety-nice gamers trying to bring the criminal to justice, or painting a whole subculture as shiftless and dangerous?
Not that I don't agree with the idea, but what's a good figure to offer as a reward, and how would we go about setting up such a program?
Mark Chance
Boingy! Boingy!
If you say so...
The whole idea is ludicrous. I've been around games for pushing 30-years. Not even the so-called height of anti-gaming ever approached the level of more than a shrill, ridiculous minority.
If you say so. It isn't the impression people have of me, unless, of course, people are lying. If I sat down and thought really, really hard, I might be able to count on one hand the number of times people have had a negative reaction to my hobby.
Ah, college towns. Where the herd of independent minds goes to drink deeply at the wells of conformity.
And I haven't. Neither have any of my friends or other gaming-acquaintances (at least, not that they've ever shared).
What's more, I really don't care what other people think about my hobbies. Back to that one hand on which I can count, I have about one person in the entire world per finger who has opinions about anything that I'm likely to give serious consideration.
Assume for a moment that there are legions of anti-gaming bigots hiding in the shadows (probably mostly in college towns) just looking for an excuse to witch-hunt all of us poor, vilified gamers. Given that assumption, there is not a thing you or I or anyone else can do to get rid of the bigotry.
Bigotry is immune to reason, but not to apathy. So, gamers of the world! Unite! Yawn at the anti-gaming bigots. Refuse to even address their concerns. Ignore them into oblivion. You have nothing to lose but your chains!
Mordane76 said:
The whole idea is ludicrous. I've been around games for pushing 30-years. Not even the so-called height of anti-gaming ever approached the level of more than a shrill, ridiculous minority.
If you say so. It isn't the impression people have of me, unless, of course, people are lying. If I sat down and thought really, really hard, I might be able to count on one hand the number of times people have had a negative reaction to my hobby.
Ah, college towns. Where the herd of independent minds goes to drink deeply at the wells of conformity.
And I haven't. Neither have any of my friends or other gaming-acquaintances (at least, not that they've ever shared).
What's more, I really don't care what other people think about my hobbies. Back to that one hand on which I can count, I have about one person in the entire world per finger who has opinions about anything that I'm likely to give serious consideration.
Assume for a moment that there are legions of anti-gaming bigots hiding in the shadows (probably mostly in college towns) just looking for an excuse to witch-hunt all of us poor, vilified gamers. Given that assumption, there is not a thing you or I or anyone else can do to get rid of the bigotry.
Bigotry is immune to reason, but not to apathy. So, gamers of the world! Unite! Yawn at the anti-gaming bigots. Refuse to even address their concerns. Ignore them into oblivion. You have nothing to lose but your chains!
Mordane76
First Post
Okay -- maybe I'm wrong.
Maybe the masses aren't the sheep I take them for. Maybe we aren't as villified and evil as I've heard them say we are. Maybe I'm just the unfortunate one who's had the bad experiences with the non-gaming community. Maybe I'm paranoid.
I just get so upset when I hear people who are "experts" go out and bash Gaming to a public I know is eager to find someone to blame for such a heinous crime. It's not like we're dealing with assault or some form of larceny -- this is a descipable murder. Everytime something like this comes up, it gives people like the 700 Club more bile to spew at the masses. I know the stigma I had to fight when I took up gaming from my parents ---> I had to convince them that Satan was taking me to Hell for paying these games, and they still to this day (even though I live over a thousand miles away) worry about my hobby taking over my life. This is the kind of imprinting that I worry about; another generation hearing the nearly urban legend-like stories about gamers and their 'evils.'
I apologize if I offended anyone with my rants... I just got a bit worked up about the topic.
Maybe the masses aren't the sheep I take them for. Maybe we aren't as villified and evil as I've heard them say we are. Maybe I'm just the unfortunate one who's had the bad experiences with the non-gaming community. Maybe I'm paranoid.
I just get so upset when I hear people who are "experts" go out and bash Gaming to a public I know is eager to find someone to blame for such a heinous crime. It's not like we're dealing with assault or some form of larceny -- this is a descipable murder. Everytime something like this comes up, it gives people like the 700 Club more bile to spew at the masses. I know the stigma I had to fight when I took up gaming from my parents ---> I had to convince them that Satan was taking me to Hell for paying these games, and they still to this day (even though I live over a thousand miles away) worry about my hobby taking over my life. This is the kind of imprinting that I worry about; another generation hearing the nearly urban legend-like stories about gamers and their 'evils.'
I apologize if I offended anyone with my rants... I just got a bit worked up about the topic.
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Mark Chance
Boingy! Boingy!
Well...
In the quote I saw quoted from the expert, I didn't see any bashing. I saw a speculation, one that could very well be true. If this poor kid was a gamer and if he was murdered (which seems most likely), then it is not unreasonable to suspect that his hobbies and his friends might have had something to do with his death. It is not outside the realm of possibility.
As opposed to this level-headed, even-handed view of the 700 Club and its viewers? Anti-gaming prejudice is a giant no-no, but it's okay to bash the deeply held religious beliefs of others?
Been there, done that, got over it a long time ago.
This might sound facetious, but the best way to deal with this sort of attitude is to ignore it. I have some experience with real prejudice, being a conversative Protestant, child of fundamentalist Protestants, husband to a Catholic and father of two Catholic children.
The line goes something like this: "I understand that you love me, and that you are doing what you think is best, but the facts are these: You don't know what you're talking about it, and I'm really not interested in your misinformed opinions anymore. Keep them to yourself. That is not a polite suggestion. It is an absolute demand."
I found this works well on any number of topics: gaming, infant baptism, marrying a Catholic, et cetera.
Mordane76 said:
In the quote I saw quoted from the expert, I didn't see any bashing. I saw a speculation, one that could very well be true. If this poor kid was a gamer and if he was murdered (which seems most likely), then it is not unreasonable to suspect that his hobbies and his friends might have had something to do with his death. It is not outside the realm of possibility.
As opposed to this level-headed, even-handed view of the 700 Club and its viewers? Anti-gaming prejudice is a giant no-no, but it's okay to bash the deeply held religious beliefs of others?
Been there, done that, got over it a long time ago.
This might sound facetious, but the best way to deal with this sort of attitude is to ignore it. I have some experience with real prejudice, being a conversative Protestant, child of fundamentalist Protestants, husband to a Catholic and father of two Catholic children.
The line goes something like this: "I understand that you love me, and that you are doing what you think is best, but the facts are these: You don't know what you're talking about it, and I'm really not interested in your misinformed opinions anymore. Keep them to yourself. That is not a polite suggestion. It is an absolute demand."
I found this works well on any number of topics: gaming, infant baptism, marrying a Catholic, et cetera.
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D and D villany
I understand that gamers dont want the hobby thrown in a bad light, and that you are afraid of the same uninformed attitudes that have always followed RPG's. But honestly it has never really prohibited anyone from playing, in fact it promotes gamers to gather together. The media and society at large will always look for someone or thing to blame for the misforunate deeds of others, it has to becuase society at large cannot accept that normal folk can commit such hienous acts. At columbine they blamed music and video games for the cuase, not the parents of the children. Personally I dont see why gamers would care if gaming was blamed for whatever ill deed that someone is trying to attribute to it, it's not going to stop you from gaming. And the new gamers are more likely to play it just becuase it's in the news, so if you think about it this is actually good for gaming in a way. Now im not advocating the slaying of anyone to increase the popularity of any hobby, and I really do hope they catch whoever is responsible. But come on this really isnt going to hurt roleplaying at large, and if your worried about what playing a game makes people think about you then you have a lot more to worry about than that. So society at large thinks we are geeks, so what? You have some pretty good company in geekdom.
I understand that gamers dont want the hobby thrown in a bad light, and that you are afraid of the same uninformed attitudes that have always followed RPG's. But honestly it has never really prohibited anyone from playing, in fact it promotes gamers to gather together. The media and society at large will always look for someone or thing to blame for the misforunate deeds of others, it has to becuase society at large cannot accept that normal folk can commit such hienous acts. At columbine they blamed music and video games for the cuase, not the parents of the children. Personally I dont see why gamers would care if gaming was blamed for whatever ill deed that someone is trying to attribute to it, it's not going to stop you from gaming. And the new gamers are more likely to play it just becuase it's in the news, so if you think about it this is actually good for gaming in a way. Now im not advocating the slaying of anyone to increase the popularity of any hobby, and I really do hope they catch whoever is responsible. But come on this really isnt going to hurt roleplaying at large, and if your worried about what playing a game makes people think about you then you have a lot more to worry about than that. So society at large thinks we are geeks, so what? You have some pretty good company in geekdom.
Mordane76
First Post
Thanks, guys...
** climbs out of religious-nutbar fighting trench, puts away Pat Robertson tazer **
I know you guys are right... just hate it when people point the finger at everything but the truth. It's very sad that this young man died, and I would really hate to find out that the disturbed individual that committed this act actually did it for some gaming-related reason, but if that's what happens, I hope people other than us gamers remember just because gaming was involved, gaming didn't cause this to happen ---> the already presented disturbed mental state of the criminal caused this, because I find it very hard to believe if this wasn't some very bizarre and unfortunate accident, that whoever did this wasn't mentally disturbed before they started gaming.
** climbs out of religious-nutbar fighting trench, puts away Pat Robertson tazer **
I know you guys are right... just hate it when people point the finger at everything but the truth. It's very sad that this young man died, and I would really hate to find out that the disturbed individual that committed this act actually did it for some gaming-related reason, but if that's what happens, I hope people other than us gamers remember just because gaming was involved, gaming didn't cause this to happen ---> the already presented disturbed mental state of the criminal caused this, because I find it very hard to believe if this wasn't some very bizarre and unfortunate accident, that whoever did this wasn't mentally disturbed before they started gaming.
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