D&D General No Fixed Location -- dynamically rearranging items, monsters, and other game elements in the interests of storytelling

[Charlaquin]

But someone who looks down on planning a contingency is definitely going to look down on having no contingency at all and just winging it, aren't they? As far as I can tell, both approaches validate/invalidate player agency to an equal degree.

Probably depends on their goals. It sounds like one of @iserith ’s goals is to keep unused prep to a minimum, so he would likely be more ok with winging it than contingency planning. On the other hand, @Lanefan ‘s goals seem to be to act as a completely impartial referee, so he would probably not be super cool with winging it, but might be more ok with contingency planning (at a guess, I’d say it probably depends on the particulars of the contingencies for him - for example, the idea that a festival would happen “three days after the players arrive in town” would probably be a non-starter for him, but “if the players are in town on the 7th of Winterstide, the following festival is taking place: [details of the festival follow] would probably be A-Okay with him. Pretty much the opposite of what I imagine would be @iserith’s preference.)

 

[iserith]

Pretty much the opposite of what I imagine would be @iserith’s preference.)

Depends on how I'm designing something really. I could write an adventure where either is fine.

 

[Charlaquin]

Depends on how I'm designing something really. I could write an adventure where either is fine.

You don’t think that planning out the details of a festival that occurs on a particular date with no guarantee the players will actually be present for it on that date sounds like an unacceptable amount of potentially wasted prep?

 

[iserith]

You don’t think that planning out the details of a festival that occurs on a particular date with no guarantee the players will actually be present for it on that date sounds like an unacceptable amount of potentially wasted prep?

Again, it really depends. If I was writing a scenario where the festival could be missed, I certainly wouldn't spend a lot of time on the prep compared to a scenario where the festival can't be missed. So it's all relative. I can also imagine a scenario where the festival isn't really a thing that's played out, but is some kind of event that just marks the passage of time and changes the outcome of the scenario.

In general, I'm going to err on the side of the least amount of wasted prep as possible given the scenario I'm trying to create.

 

[Prakriti]

How does winging it invalidate player agency? I'm not forcing them down any path or invalidating their decisions in any way. I'm simply responding on the fly to what they do.

I didn't say that it does invalidate player agency, only that both methods validate/invalidate it to an equal degree. That degree might be "not at all." It might be "lots." It might be "-4,038.3." The point is, one method doesn't validate/invalidate player agency any more or less than the other. They are, as far as I can tell, equal.

 

[seebs]

I call it "what you search for twice exists". It might not exist where you searched for it, but the fact that you looked twice means you will find the setting more realistic if it exists somewhere.

 

[Lanefan]

Probably depends on their goals. It sounds like one of @iserith ’s goals is to keep unused prep to a minimum, so he would likely be more ok with winging it than contingency planning. On the other hand, @Lanefan ‘s goals seem to be to act as a completely impartial referee, so he would probably not be super cool with winging it, but might be more ok with contingency planning (at a guess, I’d say it probably depends on the particulars of the contingencies for him - for example, the idea that a festival would happen “three days after the players arrive in town” would probably be a non-starter for him, but “if the players are in town on the 7th of Winterstide, the following festival is taking place: [details of the festival follow] would probably be A-Okay with him.)

Yeah, more or less, but context matters as well.

If the festival is merely background scenery and mostly-to-entirely unimportant to the adventure then I'm not too worried about it just happening on the third day the party is in town; but if it's important to the adventure that they be there then a) somehow I'll have let them know this, b) set a hard date for the festival, and then c) if they make it they make it and if not they're playing catch-up.

For example: the party already know they need to talk Jack Frost into loaning them his ice wand in order to enter the frozen Halls of Foraya; they now learn the only place Jack reliably appears each year is at the festival held on each winter solstice in Freyrsheld. So, they've got to get to Freyrsheld by the solstice - which if it's already early December means they've got some fast travellin' to do. If they make it, things proceed. If they don't, they're stuck trying to find another way of making contact with Jack - which could turn into a whole sub-adventure on its own!

That said, the above would be more appropriate in a homebrew adventure where I've at least go a vague idea what time of year it'll be in the fiction; a published module detailing a winter festival causes headaches if I want to run the adventure but in the game world it's early summer.

Don't get me wrong - I don't at all mind winging it if they go off the prepped farm or if they catch me off guard with an unexpected question; it happens all the time. But note that in these cases I'm adding content that didn't previously exist in my notes or the published module, which is quite different from changing pre-existing content in direct reaction to what the players/PCs have done.

 

[Lanefan]

You don’t think that planning out the details of a festival that occurs on a particular date with no guarantee the players will actually be present for it on that date sounds like an unacceptable amount of potentially wasted prep?

No.

Why?

Because my "planning out the details" would most likely consist of 20-ish words on a piece of paper (those being shorthand for many more), which I can do in a few minutes.

Those 20-ish words might look like "winterfest Freyrsheld F40 annual big deal - JF appear noon, 15 min, knows party but not why, attack=vanish, JF non-com"

This is enough to remind me: "Every year the city of Freyrsheld shuts down for the day on winter solstice (date: Flaige 40) for a big festival, which most of the townsfolk attend if they can. Jack Frost usually appears around noon and stays for 15 minutes or so, dancing, throwing snowballs, and generally causing pleasant wintry chaos. This year he's been divinely warned to expect to meet the party but hasn't been told why, or what they want from him. If the party attack him he'll disappear - he's a non-combatant and will not willingly fight anyone or anything - and will be very reluctant to talk with them later should they find him by other means."

What I'd also have to do in an established campaign would be look back at the game logs and make bloody sure no party had been in Freyrsheld on any previous winter solstice! (if they have, this idea goes bye-bye and I have to think of something else) Otherwise, thenceforth this festival becomes part of that town's lore even if no party ever goes there.