Non-Core Class Survivor: Round 17 (Final 3)

[Shade]

I like the duskblade--I am, in fact, currently playing one--but I still voted for it to go. The scout and the warlock fill essential fantasy archetypes/niches far more than the duskblade does. Yes, you can get something similar to the scout with ranger and/or rogue--but it's only close, not quite. Frankly, I prefer the scout as the archetypal wilderness character, with rangers being far more rare and mystical. To use the old SAT format, "ranger is to druid as paladin is to cleric." I don't feel rangers should represent the "standard" wilderness character. The scout, however, is perfect for that.

What he said.

 

[Steel_Wind]

The duskblade should have been hoofed long ago.

Adios amigo.

 

[Presto2112]

Duskblade, scout, warlock
warlock has too few choices
is the wind changing ?

Is haiku 5,7,5? Dang I thought it was the other way around!

 

[Mercule]

Mouse, you've got a good point with the Ranger/Scout. But, with the current Ranger build, it doesn't hold up. If the Ranger was the Special Forces soldier he should be, I'd be plenty happy leaving the Scout to be the Boyscout.

Warlock, I like. Scout is redundant. Duskblade I'm concerned about power.

Given those options, I'm tapping redundant to leave.

 

[Desdichado]

Mouse, you've got a good point with the Ranger/Scout. But, with the current Ranger build, it doesn't hold up. If the Ranger was the Special Forces soldier he should be, I'd be plenty happy leaving the Scout to be the Boyscout.

Hmmm... I hadn't quite thought of it that way. If the current Ranger was more like the 3e Ranger, would you still feel that way?

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I think that class is the greatest thing since sliced bread; finally a good Gish class from level 1..

I vote to kill any class described as "gish" because it's illegal to kill the people who say that word.

 

[Shade]

I vote to kill any class described as "gish" because it's illegal to kill the people who say that word.

What's wrong with gish?

It's a helluva lot better gaming term than munchkin, roll-player, or fluff.

 

[Jdvn1]

It's neck and neck!

 

[Mercule]

Hmmm... I hadn't quite thought of it that way. If the current Ranger was more like the 3e Ranger, would you still feel that way?

Disclaimer: Ranger may be the most divisive archetype in the game. What follows is based on my opinion, alone.

I don't completely remember the 3.0 Ranger. I know it had higher hit dice and fewer skill points. It was also locked into TWF. From what I recall, I didn't much care for it, either.

I'd like to see d10 HD, because I see the Ranger as being pretty tough -- maybe marginally tougher than the Fighter, but not enough to warrant a d12. The d8 immediately signals to me that the 3.5 Ranger isn't even what I'd consider a Ranger.

I think the combat styles should be dropped completely. They're an okay idea -- make the Ranger second only to Fighter in a straight-up combat -- but ultimately don't do much. Since 2E came out I've been trying to figure out what possible connection a commando has with automatic TWF. It just doesn't make sense as a class feature. Archery does make some sense, but I don't think it's implemented very well. Plus, I'm not a huge fan of virtual feats.

I'd like to see the Favored Terrain from UA added to the Favored Enemy options. I like the Ranger as a specialist in certain types of combat situations, but they don't need to be genocidal. Actually, it might be interesting to give Rangers the option of Favored Enemy, Favored Terrain, or a combat feat at various levels. That'd give you a specialized commando, but customizable for the player.

I don't like the association with Druid. I don't think that really fits. Again, the Ranger is more of a Commando, IMO. They don't pick up magic because of any inherent religious aspect. They pick up magic because they learn to use whatever means necessary. I'd really rather see their spells be considered arcane. The only reason druid spells ever made sense, to me, is that they didn't have their own list and they would definitely have picked up some woodsy "tricks", so it was a game construct. Heck, I could even see dropping spells completely and giving them Use Magic Device as a class skill to simulate their resourcefulness, though that wouldn't be my first option.

 

[Sammael]

Most exciting poll EVAR!