Odd observation re Skills and levels

[Greenfield]

I was looking through the SRD and an odd thought crossed my mind.

Every base class gives skill points per level, with the note that the character gets 4x as many at first level.

As written, that means you get the 4x multiplier whenever you start a new base class, s a character with levels in Rogue, Ranger and Fighter will get 8+Int mod x4 (for Rogue), + 6+Int mod x 4 (for Ranger), +2+Int mod x4 for fighter, plus any others from 2nd, 3rd etc levels in any of those classes.

Yeah, I know that's not what was meant, but "at first level" could refer to the first class level, or the first character level. And since it's in the class specific reference...

It's just an odd observation. Do with it what you will.

 

[Jackinthegreen]

What do you think of a Swordsage getting x6 skill points at first level?

 

[kitcik]

I was looking through the SRD and an odd thought crossed my mind.

Every base class gives skill points per level, with the note that the character gets 4x as many at first level.

As written, that means you get the 4x multiplier whenever you start a new base class, s a character with levels in Rogue, Ranger and Fighter will get 8+Int mod x4 (for Rogue), + 6+Int mod x 4 (for Ranger), +2+Int mod x4 for fighter, plus any others from 2nd, 3rd etc levels in any of those classes.

Yeah, I know that's not what was meant, but "at first level" could refer to the first class level, or the first character level. And since it's in the class specific reference...

It's just an odd observation. Do with it what you will.

The intent is made clear in the first paragraph of "Gaining Skills" on page 61 of the PH which refers to the "first character level overall."

 

[Dross]

The intent is made clear in the first paragraph of "Gaining Skills" on page 61 of the PH which refers to the "first character level overall."

I think there is also a reference on the multicalss section on leveling up in the PHB that addresses this (1st character level only)

 

[Herzog]

It's one of the less thought out rules in 3.5, IMO, together with max hp at first level.

Sure, it makes sense to give starting characters some kind of boost to make sure they're not totally useless (starting out with 1hp and/or 1 skill point isn't much fun)

However, it immediately brings up the power decision for multiclassing:
If you're building a Multiclass character that depends on skills, take your first level in the class with the highest number of skillpoints/lvl, because you'll be getting the most out of it at that level.
If you're building a Multiclass fighter character, take the class with the highest HD at first level, because those hp will be maxed.

I think a fixed starting boost, regardless of character class, would have been better.
Like:
At first level, regardless of character class, every character gets 10 skillpoints and 5 hp, in addition to the hp roll and the skill points gained from the class.

Note that these are just numbers I pulled out of my.. ehm... hat! So don't go bashing on the details. I think a thorough numbercrunching should be in order to determine correct hp/sp to assign at first level, but this is the general idea.

(also note I haven't actually tried to implement this in any game. I just came up with it as a possible solution to what I think is a 'fault' in the system)

 

[Dandu]

I think a thorough numbercrunching should be in order to determine correct hp/sp to assign at first level

Madness!

 

[Ashtagon]

I wonder if these bonus skill points can't be re-phrased as a certain number of bonus Skill Focus feats, and then a note in the multi-classing rules to say that if you multi-class into a new class that would have more, then you immediately gain additional bonus Skill Focus feats equal to the difference.

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

However, it immediately brings up the power decision for multiclassing:
If you're building a Multiclass character that depends on skills, take your first level in the class with the highest number of skillpoints/lvl, because you'll be getting the most out of it at that level.
If you're building a Multiclass fighter character, take the class with the highest HD at first level, because those hp will be maxed.

I'm not seeing the problem with this, even from an RP, in-game standpoint.

If I was a fledgling adventurer who desired to study multiple disciplines of adventure hero and had a pretty good idea of that beforehand, it is not unreasonable to think that I'd consider which discipline to pursue, in what order. If I expected to become a Rogue/Wizard/Fighter, I'd decide which path would give me the greatest gain early on, or perhaps further down the road, assuming I was somewhat educated as to what my choices where beforehand.

 

[Androrc]

It's one of the less thought out rules in 3.5, IMO, together with max hp at first level.

Sure, it makes sense to give starting characters some kind of boost to make sure they're not totally useless (starting out with 1hp and/or 1 skill point isn't much fun)

However, it immediately brings up the power decision for multiclassing:
If you're building a Multiclass character that depends on skills, take your first level in the class with the highest number of skillpoints/lvl, because you'll be getting the most out of it at that level.
If you're building a Multiclass fighter character, take the class with the highest HD at first level, because those hp will be maxed.

I think a fixed starting boost, regardless of character class, would have been better.
Like:
At first level, regardless of character class, every character gets 10 skillpoints and 5 hp, in addition to the hp roll and the skill points gained from the class.

Note that these are just numbers I pulled out of my.. ehm... hat! So don't go bashing on the details. I think a thorough numbercrunching should be in order to determine correct hp/sp to assign at first level, but this is the general idea.

(also note I haven't actually tried to implement this in any game. I just came up with it as a possible solution to what I think is a 'fault' in the system)

I like your idea. But I'd rather have it as a race-based bonus to HP than a generic one.

 

[nonsi256]

What about a commoner that goes to practice to gain his 1st [whatever] class level ?
What happened to his 1st commoner HD stats ? (HP, skillpoints, class skills etc)