Official Rules Updates (March 02, 2010)

[Votan]

Orb of Imposition needed to be weakened, but this is too weak. It should have let you impose the penalty to one saving throw, after it was rolled, as a free action.

Wouldn't that bring back the issues of lockdown, to some extent? After all, if you have a narrow window of saves (by stacking penalties) then a critter needs to get lucky twice in a sequence of rolls if the power is applied after the roll is made (and it could be the case that the first roll is unbeatable guarenteeing one round).

Now to get the huge save penalties of the OoI you have to actually use the resource . . .

I'd agree with you if there were very options to generate save penalties but the list seems more extensive over time.

 

[Elric]

Wouldn't that bring back the issues of lockdown, to some extent? After all, if you have a narrow window of saves (by stacking penalties) then a critter needs to get lucky twice in a sequence of rolls if the power is applied after the roll is made (and it could be the case that the first roll is unbeatable guarenteeing one round).

Now to get the huge save penalties of the OoI you have to actually use the resource . . .

I'd agree with you if there were very options to generate save penalties but the list seems more extensive over time.

Abilities that give large ongoing penalties to saves need weakening on their own. I'm not aware of any recent finds, but of the original save penalty abilities, only Cunning Weapons still seem in need of weakening (to the "for the first saving throw" language used elsewhere. Edit: never mind, this was fixed in the March update. The incredible number of updates means that without character builder, keeping up with all of them is infeasible).

Well, Skull Mask too (should just be your own fear effects).

 

[Votan]

Abilities that give large ongoing penalties to saves need weakening on their own. I'm not aware of any recent finds, but of the original save penalty abilities, only Cunning Weapons still seem in need of weakening (to the "for the first saving throw" language used elsewhere. Edit: never mind, this was fixed in the March update. The incredible number of updates means that without character builder, keeping up with all of them is infeasible).

Well, Skull Mask too (should just be your own fear effects).

Ah, okay, if they are altering all of the ways to get save penalties to being for a single save then I am a bit more sympathetic to the group that wanted the Orb of Imposition to be an immediate interrupt (rather than needing to be declared in advance).