OGL To Be Renamed Game System License (GSL)

[Nellisir]

I'd like to throw this out there also, because I know I tend to get a bit snarky and sarcastic in my replies - John RTroy, while I disagree with you in some particulars (and I suspect fewer of those than might be obvious), you've done an excellent job of maintaining your temper and poise throughout this thread, and I admire that. Well done, sir!


Now bugger off and let us get down to ripping the guts out of 4e.

 

[Oldtimer]

Actually, I'm fairly certain Wizards does own the ideas behind 4e, legally, morally, ethically and by any other standard one would normally apply to "ownership".

Maybe your by standards. They don't agree with the legal, moral, ethical or other standards elsewhere, though.

Ideas are NOT owned. As simple as that.

 

[Oldtimer]

Well, I am thinking of the people who worked hard to create 4e, and then to have others take there work and reverse-engineer it is wrong. 4e is a different animal.

You think it's wrong. That doesn't make it wrong.

Considering you're from the country that has the Pirate Party, Piratbyrån, and The Pirate Bay, I can see why you'd think that.

And those things sure makes me proud to live in this country.

I have a feeling some of those revolutions will lead to some reforms, but other aspects of it will be similar to the United States "hippie movement". We never did end up living in communes and legalizing hallucinogens. I think once certain industries get hurt and people start realizing people have abandoned their creative efforts because they can't make a living off of them, some of those elements will be reversed.

And I think you're wrong. This is not a "hippie movement". This is the end of a short parenthesis in our history. Copyright in its present form is as doomed as Titanic after hitting that iceberg. Some are bound to stay on the deck and complain that the ship's tilt is ruining their game of shuffleboard. Others are busy making other plans.

 

[Oldtimer]

You can try to convince yourself with a lot of philosophical mumbo jumbo that they don't own it, but ripping the guts out of a game system, or an operating system, or a car, and using those "ideas no one can own" is stealing.

It's stealing just as much as pirating software, or scanning a comic and bit-torrenting it on pirate bay.

You really need to read up on the legal definition of "stealing". None of the above are stealing.

 

[Urizen]

Here's my point.

3e is Free. 4e is not.

Unless I'm mistaken, 4e is not free, only if you want to buy in on the Phase 1 developers kit.

After June 2008, publishers will have free access to the new SRD BUT won't be able to publish anyhting until January 2009.

What I'm wondering right now is, exactly what material is being left out of the new SRD?

Does anyone know?

 

[pawsplay]

They may not have rights under the law, but most professional developers have a common courteously to respect that. You've finally admitted your motivation--your pissed that they decided the OGL is not a good license for them and want revenge.

I don't know how you would misread my post that way. Revenge is not a consideration at all. I am saddened by WotC's misjudgment. It probably won't affect me personally any time in the near future, but it is still very unfortunate. I also feel frustrated that over the past 10-15 years, corporate America seems to have lost its senses when it comes to IP and has little understanding of the law or the practical consequences of trying to "own" culture.

 

[Bacris]

I don't know that anyone has actually seen the OGL, let alone the SRD. Remember, the process for early-access to the SRD / rules was "Sign NDA, get GSL, pay, get rules" - I don't think the GSL is actually finished yet, is it?

If the GSL isn't finished, the SRD isn't available yet.

But, my gut tells me the new "SRD" will simply say something to the effect of "Section X of PHB is open content", etc.

 

[Urizen]

Since it's been said that the GSL will not be as "open" as the Ogl was, then - in my mind - that's the most important issue here: What will we be able to reference? What can we build on as far as rules and supplemental material?

I for one would love to expand on talent trees and things of that nature.

 

[Nellisir]

What I have argued about is that it is up to the author themselves to decide how it should be accessed, not "the people".

It looks like you're dismissing "the people".
Copyright serves two functions - first, it protects the rights of an author to his own work. Secondly, and often forgotten, copyright acts for the greater good by terminating the rights of an author or creator after a period of time (initially 15 years in the US, now life+75?). An author does not always act in the best interests of the people or his work; reversion to the public domain helps protect those interests.

Now, this isn't directly related to the matter at hand. D&D is still safely copyrighted. But the fact of the matter is that the people's interests are not, and ought not to be, automatically subjugated or subordinated to the rights of the author.

 

[xechnao]

What I have argued about is that it is up to the author themselves to decide how it should be accessed, not "the people".

It is always "the people". Humans are social creatures and this is proven. There is not such a thing as "free will" -or at least proven scientifically. What exists is happiness or misery -comfort or stress. Will OGL make Wotc stuff miserable eventualy? This is the debate over here.