D&D General Old School DND talks if DND is racist.

[Charlaquin]

how is killing a thing not overcoming a challenge?

It can be, but it also isn’t the only way to overcome a challenge. And there are some challenges that can’t be overcome by killing. Point is, the killing itself is generally not what people award XP for these days. If they award XP at all.

 

[Mind of tempest]

I’m quite sure that was the case. But the thing is, outcomes matter infinitely more than intent. Gary and company almost certainly weren’t trying to make a point about real world people. They just weren’t aware that they were perpetuating a harmful sociological trope. Now that awareness is increasing, we have the opportunity to address issues with the game that, while not created out of malice, still exist and make the game less welcoming to certain people. And I for one want to encourage the caretakers of the brand to take advantage of that opportunity.

well said as the line goes "both intent and consequences can damn you but consequences can damn others too."

 

[Charlaquin]

Does that include gaining XP for accumulating treasure? Because if so, that's a case of what's old becoming new again.

It can. Again, I think XP in general is falling out of fashion. The folks who continue to use it often have old-school sensibilities, so it’s not surprising that XP for gold might see a resurgence among them.

 

[Mannahnin]

I'm not sure Games Workshop has ever been politically conscious.

They had an absolute shed-ton of political satire and reference in most of their 80s material. Now, that's not to say that they didn't have any racial issues or blind spots.

 

[Mind of tempest]

It can. Again, I think XP in general is falling out of fashion. The folks who continue to use it often have old-school sensibilities, so it’s not surprising that XP for gold might see a resurgence among them.

or video game sensibilities.

They had an absolute shed-ton of political satire and reference in most of their 80s material. Now, that's not to say that they didn't have any racial issues or blind spots.

I am from the UK those blind spots are stuffed into the culture and rather hard to see past.

 

[Alzrius]

It can. Again, I think XP in general is falling out of fashion. The folks who continue to use it often have old-school sensibilities, so it’s not surprising that XP for gold might see a resurgence among them.

I wonder how much crossover with computer and console RPGs might ablate this. Insofar as I know (I don't play many of them anymore) those systems still use XP for leveling, and there's plenty of permeability between those and tabletop RPGs.

 

[Charlaquin]

or video game sensibilities.

true!

 

[Charlaquin]

I wonder how much crossover with computer and console RPGs might ablate this. Insofar as I know (I don't play many of them anymore) those systems still use XP for leveling, and there's plenty of permeability between those and tabletop RPGs.

Yeah, that definitely also plays a role.

 

[Zardnaar]

Ah I was wondering then the conversation was going to come to this point. The concept of Original Sin has a secular version these days {i.e., "judge me not based on my deeds and beliefs, but on the sins of my ancestors").

All around this topic is full of depressing toxicity. It's not enough to be aware and respectful of historical injustices on marginalized peoples. You have to make up for it, here an now, because of the lottery of your birth. If you suffer hardship or injustice, tough naughty word, others had it worse before you.

Yikes.

If you lecture people on white privilege it's just gonna make them angry and is entirely counter productive.

It's also not that applicable to everyone. Eg I grew up in essentially a monoculture small town on the wrong side of the tracks.

Getting lectured on my privilege is funny espicially since it usually comes from middle class or better type backgrounds.

It was violent as well body still has scars from punches (teeth through lip), cuts with a chisel circa 1992 and stab marks from pencils.

It was legal for teachers to hit you with the strap and cane. They stripped all the lockers out at school as they got used as torture devices. Head meet limestone wall happened, one got head meet concrete wall skull broken.

Teachers weren't safe either saw them get assaulted as well.

If you're from the hoods of Baltimore lecture away. If you came from a middle class background and went to university thanks to mommy and daddy stfu basically.

Would be interesting to see the backgrounds of a lot of posters here lol. Wonder how many schools had lockers removed.

Thankfully the full on crazies added togather add up to around 10% total of the population.

 

[Umbran]

It's difficult to reconcile the idea that we're not particularly welcoming while simultaneously cheering about the booming success of 5th edition with all the new players.

Not really. I don't expect there's a huge amount of crossover between the groups. There are enough of those new players that they don't need our welcome any more.