OOC - [Epic] Scions of the Endless Falls - Full

[Kelleris]

How about we just go with the standard rule of x2 for a no-slot item as that is how they are listed in the game?

I second that. My take on it is that you gain the impossibility of the "item" being physically destroyed (which rarely happens anyway, except to weapons and armor) and lose the ability to loan and (more importantly) sell and upgrade the item. It strikes me as a wash overall.

As for the items, I'll explain my pricing once I'm on a computer with a better connection than this nasty dial-up modem. However, I will say that I was just generally expecting that 800,000 gold would be sufficient for making up for any +/- differences that come up.

I just want to know how the raw numbers and feat selections look. They'll be around there in the end, maybe plus or minus 2 points or so. I haven't played epic before, so I would like to know what's high for this level, what's low, and what's merely "eh." Please?

Oh, by the way. While the chakras are considered an epic item, they don't get the price multiplied by 10 just for that reason. That's just the convention they follow for the higher bonuses. As long as you don't break into any of the wiggy bonuses of epic levels, you still use the same pricing guidelines you always did. Why do you think things like those boots of swiftness cost as much as they do? Surely you don't think that the base price was only 25,600 for them? The bonus to Dex alone costs more than that!

All the epic thing means is that it requires Craft Epic Wondrous Item to make and a caster level of at least 21. By itself, that does nothing at all to the price.

 

[Kangaxx]

I drastically underestimated the amount of time this would require. I had to make a spreadsheet to do Pilmer's skills, for keeping track of his constantly increasing int and constantly shifting class. If anyone wants to double check my math, I can email you a copy.

But now all I have left is magic items and developing a spellbook, so hopefully I'll be done today.

 

[Ferrix]

Also a note is that the epic constructor they have is actually for the 3.0 version of the constructor.

 

[Wrahn]

Grants a bonus on attacks or damage greater than +5.
Grants an enhancement bonus to armor higher than +5.
Has a special ability with a market price modifier greater than +5.
Grants an armor bonus of greater than +10 (not including magic armor’s enhancement bonus).
Grants a natural armor, deflection, or resistance bonus greater than +5.
Grants an enhancement bonus to an ability score greater than +6.
Grants an enhancement bonus on a skill check greater than +30.
Mimics a spell of an effective level higher than 9th.
Has a caster level above 20th.
Has a market price above 200,000 gp, not including material costs for armor or weapons, material component- or experience point-based costs, or additional value for intelligent items.

Those are the qualifications for the epic costs, anything that falls into those catagories get's the x10 multiplier.

*******

Isida,

I was thinking Monks Belt.

As far as what the basic rules say about Tattoos other than the psionic stuff is nothing. x2 is for not having an item slot, like an Ioun Stone, not to become part of your character.

Not being able to sell the "item" or to trade it is a limitation, but being unable to remove it from you far outweighs those inconviences. Which is why I charge the x3.

 

[Ferrix]

We could just say that magical tattoos function like psionic tattoos in that you can transfer them willing to another creature or take them from an unconscious creature. And that just leaves them as normal x2 no-slot items.

 

[Wrahn]

Ferrix-

We could agree that the psionic tattoos are indeed worth the x2, however, I still wish mine to be of the unremovable variety.

I understand and at least partially agree about the Constructor, but you are over looking a something. I am not sure is this is the way it actually works, but they mentioned Empowered Astral Constructs, which leads me to believe you could Intensify one.

An intensified one would have 420 hit points, it would hit for 40 points of damage a swing, it’s real problem isn’t that it will be obliterated, it is that it will be ignored. With only a +28 to attack people can pretty much ignore its existence while they concentrate on the generator (you).

I would add a pretty hefty insight bonus to hit (+10-+20 depending) on the D list and call it a day. Maybe an Always hasted ability too.

I guess what I am saying is that the tools exist to make it workable, why reinvent the wheel.

Edit

Oh and Kangaxx, if you want to send it to me at Wrahnn(at)yahoo(dot)com, I would be happy to look it over.

 

[Ferrix]

Well if the wheel is square, I wouldn't call it very effective.

 

[Wrahn]

I just read the section in the SRD closer, while I am pretty sure the epic level handbook just gave it a flat x10, apparently it doesn’t work that way any longer. It only applies to bonuses that fall into the epic level. Which, for reference, is open to incredible abuses. Example:

Wish, at will 9x17x1800 + 5000x5x100 = 2,775,400

This looks like a lot, but it is incredibly abusive. That is any spell, eighth level or lower, at will. No need to buy books, you will have the +5 inherent bonus to all stats, heck if you are working together with the rest of the party, they will have +5 to all their stats too. Gah!

Gee, I am thirsty, I could walk across the room, no wait, I will wish the room to move across to me.

Oh well, I am beginning to form a character idea even as I type. Lazy man and his incredible wish machine. He could sit around and peddle his services on street corners.

25gp and you can have +5 inherent bonus to all your stats, 100gp and I will do them all. Make up that 3 million in no time. Army comes to steal your wish machine? No problem, wish them to another country.

Ah well, no one has done this at this point so it doesn’t matter.


Ferrix-

I don't think it is square, maybe octagonol

You could turn it with some work.

 

[Kelleris]

Wrahn, you're half right, it is an epic item. There is nothing that says that it arbitrarily gets multiplied by 10 for that reason. If there were, it would still be wrong, snce the item is hardly worth that much and those are guidelines, not hard-and-fast rules.

if you did think that, you also commit yourself to some pretty silly pricings. For one thing, it would be impossible to have any epic item worth less than 2 million gold that wasn't granting a flat bonus. There are at least a dozen examples of items in the ELH that prove this wrong, the boots of swiftness I mentioned among them.

Even aside from all that, the 200,000 gold limit is hardly something hard and fast even in the core rules. Look at the greater metamagic rod of quickening, for instance.

Thanks for catching the other stuff, though. I doubled the charm cost and made it an insight bonus, and dropped the metamagic rod.

@ Isida - I should point out that the last subdivision of items on my list are slotless and nonphysical, for whatever reason. I did double price for most of them and 2.25x for a few others. As I stated above, I think the inability to trade them in later when I find a superior item (they can't be sold or "taken off") balances the invulnerability to physical destruction (though they can still be dispelled or disjoined as normal). I'm working on the item backgrounds right now, and I'll be more specific about what they can do (especially the sword) and how I priced them.

 

[Ferrix]

I just read the section in the SRD closer, while I am pretty sure the epic level handbook just gave it a flat x10, apparently it doesn?t work that way any longer. It only applies to bonuses that fall into the epic level. Which, for reference, is open to incredible abuses. Example:

Wish, at will 9x17x1800 + 5000x5x100 = 2,775,400

This looks like a lot, but it is incredibly abusive. That is any spell, eighth level or lower, at will. No need to buy books, you will have the +5 inherent bonus to all stats, heck if you are working together with the rest of the party, they will have +5 to all their stats too. Gah!

Gee, I am thirsty, I could walk across the room, no wait, I will wish the room to move across to me.

Oh well, I am beginning to form a character idea even as I type. Lazy man and his incredible wish machine. He could sit around and peddle his services on street corners.

25gp and you can have +5 inherent bonus to all your stats, 100gp and I will do them all. Make up that 3 million in no time. Army comes to steal your wish machine? No problem, wish them to another country.

Ah well, no one has done this at this point so it doesn?t matter.


Ferrix-

I don't think it is square, maybe octagonol

You could turn it with some work.

You could refer to the part of Isida's creation post affirming the Veto power of the DM ;-). That might work to abolish the wish peddler.