OOC - [Epic] Scions of the Endless Falls - Full

[Ferrix]

Arbitrary changing of bonus is just that: arbitrary. There can be 100,000 reasons for it, perhaps they feel that a single item with freedom of movement should be cheaper, perhaps they feel that a ring should be cheaper.

The point is, unless we are the game master, we can not make the arbitrary judgements and are left with the guidelines.

Who's being arbitrary, I'm taking a specific effect that they list as 40k gp on a ring (which has no affinity for a type of effect), to a slot that does have the body slot affinity (movement based). If that changes the cost at all which it shouldn't, I'll just leave it on the ring cause then I'm only paying 40k for it. It would be silly to assume otherwise.

Spell Resistance 19 in the DMG is a +5 Bonus when applied to armor, bringing the total modifier over +10 making it epic and bringing the cost up to 1,210,000. In non-epic circumstances it would usually be cheaper than the wondrous items, but with the epic rules I think a certain amount of caution needs to be applied to the Non-Energy Resistance, Non-skill bonus to items.

And the rules simply don't support multiplying the armor as a secondary ability even if it is the cheaper cost. Looking at the costs you always multiply the additional abilities that cost money by 1.5 (So the cost for the armor, even if it is acceptable for adding a Sacred Bonus to saves to armor for a money cost as opposed to a bonus cost it should always be multiplied by 1.5 not the armor)

However I'm not adding an effect that has a specific armor bonus modifier (like spell resistance), thus I'm pretty much going by the rules as listed except I'm multiplying the lower cost part of the item by 1.5 rather than the higher cost part (which is in the rules) but however not supported the same way in armor which is a little silly. And plus adding spell resistance 19 to a +6 piece of armor is a waste at epic levels for that amount of money, when I can have spell resistance of 32 for 200,000gp on another item.

 

[Wrahn]

Paladin 5, Cleric 1, Fist of Raziel 6, Warpriest 4, Contemplative 6

This is 22 levels, +6 from ECL = 28th, I am assuming Divinely Infused costs +1, since you lost a level with your sword?

Str: 31 (+10) [12 base, + 4 race, + 5 manual, + 1 lvl, + 6 headband, + 2 divine infused]

12+4+5+1+6+2=30 (Minor point) may want to increase this since Strength is the bread and butter stat of the warrior types.

Dex: 25 (++7) [10 base, +2 race, +5 manual, +6 headband, +2 divinely infused]
Int: 17 (+3) [10 base, +2 race, +5 tome]

May only want to buy a +4 books. Same effect, less money

Wis: 40 (+15) [16 base, + 4 race, +2 saint, +5 tome, +3 lvl, +6 headband, +4 divinely infused]
Cha: 42 (+16) [13 base, +4 race, +4 saint, +5 tome, +6 headband, +8 epic rod of splendor, +6 divinely infused]

For a character that is supposed to be focused on combat you placed a terrific emphasis statistically on these two stats. Just an observation.

As perivas noted the bonus to your Charisma from the headband and the rod are both echancement bonuses and don't stack. If I recall correctly, the Headband of Perfect Excellence is +6 to Strength, Dex and Wisdom, and doesn't give a charisma bonus anyway.

Half Celestial
AC +1

Minor point, it is +1 Natural Armor

Hit Dice: 8d8+5d8+11d10+6d6

You lost a level due to your sword, if Divinely infused is +2 LA, then you need to drop a class level.

BAB: +18/+13/+8/+3

Assuming the Fist of Raziel is a fighter BAB, 5 for Paladin + 0 for Cleric + 6 for the Fist of Raziel +4 for War Priest (I think) + 2 for Contemplative (only get 4 levels here until Epic Progression) +17 BAB. Epic BAB is not truly BAB, it has some of the properties of it (Like it adds to Maximum Power Attack) but lacks the most important one (No iterative attacks). You will get +1 Epic BAB

Saves:
Fortitude 45 [16 base, +8 con, +5 epic, +16 paladin]
Reflex 32 [4 base, +7 dex, +5 epic, +16 paladin]
Will 45 [9 base, +15 wis, +5 epic, +16 paladin]

Regular save progression does not continue after the 20th hit dice, it goes to Epic. You have 2 epic hit dice so you have a +1 Epic bonus. And for heaven’s sake get a resistance bonus, they are cheap.

Feats:
combat casting (Bonus Human)

Your concentration should be relatively impressive, I would ditch this feat

leadership (1st level)

Order is wrong for that, need to wait for 6th level (nit pick)

power attack (3rd Level),
servant of heaven (6th level),
purify spell, (9th level)
divine might, (12th level)
extra turning (15th level)
epic divine might (18th level),
improved spell capacity x2(21st and 24th level),
positive energy aura (27th level)

Okay, a few things. You only have 22 hit dice and only get feats out to that point (your skills are capped at 25 too). You don’t qualify for Improved Spell Capacity (Which requires you to have maximum spell casting ability and because you only have 17 levels of caster, the item you have only increases your caster level, not your spells per day )

You qualify for epic feats at 15th level, Were I you, I would drop extra turning, Positive Energy Aura and Combat casting unless those are required for a prestige class.

Spells Prepared
Progression [6/ 9+1/ 9+1/ 9+1/ 8+1/ 8+1/ 7+1/ 7+1/ 6+1/ 6+1/ 3/ 3]

Your extra domain slots continue with each new level of spells you get.

Armor +10 [called, sacred, soulfire, undead disrupting]

This item will be monumentally expensive (depending on the bonuses of some of those, maybe 4,000,000)

Large mithral Shield +6 [called, animated, sacred]

Again this is going to cost more than it is worth (1,000,000ish)

Weapons

Nyla
Nyla, the Holy One, lawful good intelligent bastard sword, 17th level: hardness 20, hp 21;Communication: Telepathy; Perception: Blindsense 60ft., and Hearing;

Abilities: Int12, Wis 12, Cha 15.

While I like the role playing aspects of the weapon, it is terrifically expensive (it cost you a level) and you could accomplish the same things with money.

Is it possible to buy a weapon and then add this to it? Say a +5 Sword or a Sunblade?

manuals/tomes 6*+6 822 000

825,000, you forgot the 500 at the end of the 137,500

headband of perfect excellence 180 000

The cost of this is wonky. I am not sure if it is right or wrong, but I can tell you that you can make it better by splitting it into two items. A belt for 90,000 which gives +6 Strength and Dex and a headband for 36,000 which gives +6 to Wisdom.

phylactery of faithfulness 1 000
phylactery of undead turning 11 000

Can’t wear 2 phylacteries, Combining them together: Phylactery of Faithfulness and Undead turning 12,500

caster level +5 375 000

Probably works best as a vest.

 

[Wrahn]

Cost to get an effective spell caster level increase is equal to the increase squared times 15,000gp. Thus +1 spellcaster level = 15000gp, +2 spellcaster level = 60000gp, +3 spellcaster level = 135000gp, etc.

DC increase I would say breaking down the arcanists amulet (+2 DC's for 50k) is probably either 25,000gp per +1 (linear) or bonus squared times 12500gp (exponential). Thus +1 DC = 12500gp, +2 DC = 50000gp, +3 DC = 112500gp, etc. I'd go with exponential probably as it's more balanced usually with the existing ways things increase.

For the increase to one school, the only close example I know of is the items from Expanded PsiHB which add +1 DC to those of a specific discipline. Which costs 8000gp. Probably cheaper just to go all around bonus unless you really want a high increase for a specific school.

You are going to love this Ferrix. The +2 DC is based on a spell (Greater Magic Flow 4th level, +2 to DCs) the cost of the item is of course wrong. (Read as completely Arbitrary). I would NOT deconstruct it, it is already a powerful effect. (Though the same effect could be accomplished with a 16,000gp item, it's effects stack this it is a dangerous item to be playing with)

For the sake of 1 school, were I running the game, I would halve the cost, but it's effects would not stack with the normal amulet.

 

[Wrahn]

Who's being arbitrary, I'm taking a specific effect that they list as 40k gp on a ring (which has no affinity for a type of effect), to a slot that does have the body slot affinity (movement based). If that changes the cost at all which it shouldn't, I'll just leave it on the ring cause then I'm only paying 40k for it. It would be silly to assume otherwise.

Talk to Isida is the only thing I can tell you. Following the guidelines set out it should be more expensive. Keeping it on a ring makes your argument stronger, but don't go changing your equipment on my strict interruptation of the rules (Heck if I was running the game and you said that is what you were doing and you were basing your cost on the ring, I might let you get away with it, but as players, we need to either ask the GM or assume the worst)

However I'm not adding an effect that has a specific armor bonus modifier (like spell resistance), thus I'm pretty much going by the rules as listed except I'm multiplying the lower cost part of the item by 1.5 rather than the higher cost part (which is in the rules) but however not supported the same way in armor which is a little silly. And plus adding spell resistance 19 to a +6 piece of armor is a waste at epic levels for that amount of money, when I can have spell resistance of 32 for 200,000gp on another item.

No you are adding Sacred Bonus to Saves, which falls under a grey area. I agree the 19 spell Resist on the armor is a waste, however, those are the rules just like this:

+1 Suit of Armor with a +5 Competence bonus to Hide costs:
1,000 + 3750 (2500*1.5) = 4,750 + Armor Cost

NOT

+1 Suit of Armor with a +5 Competence bonus to Hide costs:
1,500 (1,000*1.5) + 2,500 = 4,000 + armor cost * 1.5

It is just the way armor is made, check the book.

Further, Glamour, Elemental Resistance, and Skill Bonuses are the only thing that cost money not bonuses. Assuming that it doesn't cost bonuses is presumptious. (I would not allow you to do it my game, I would stay with the published stuff as those rules are murky and I am not going to venture a guess between what can be added with money and what can't be)

 

[Kangaxx]

You only have 22 hit dice and only get feats out to that point (your skills are capped at 25 too). You don’t qualify for Improved Spell Capacity (Which requires you to have maximum spell casting ability and because you only have 17 levels of caster, the item you have only increases your caster level, not your spells per day

He only needs to be able to cast 9th level spells for improved spell capacity.

 

[Wrahn]

He only needs to be able to cast 9th level spells for improved spell capacity.

You are right (I checked before I posted but misread the SRD) unfortunately he still can't take the feats because he only qualifies at his last level (22nd) and he can't delay taking the feats until then.

 

[Isida Kep'Tukari]

Aye, you must take your feats at the levels you obtain them, no "saving" feats in order to take all the high level ones.

Also, remember to label everything that came from a book other than core in your character sheets. They should be in the exact format as the sample character.

 

[Wrahn]

You are right (I checked before I posted but misread the SRD) unfortunately he still can't take the feats because he only qualifies at his last level (22nd) and he can't delay taking the feats until then.

Moving around a few things and taking more levels of Cleric, instead of Paladin may be beneficial and allow you to take your feats. You need 18th level and 21st level, so you need to get to 17th caster level by 18. Assuming spell Progression through the classes if 1 for 1, then taking levels of cleric instead of levels of paladin may save you.

1-8 Cleric
9-14 Fist of Raziel
15-16 Contemplative
17-20 War Priest
21-22 Paladin

Or whatever. At that point you could take both your Improved Spell capacity feats. Let me play around with it when I get home to my books.

 

[Kelleris]

I find it vaguely alarming that equipment is causing this much dispute... Oh, and for what it's worth, that retributive amulet thingy is crazily, ridiculously, blatantly broken. It's broken at lower levels, but it's pathetically so at 30th.

Anyway, just a quick request. I was checking out Arms and Equipment at home this weekend, and there were three weapons that I wanted to pillage special properties from. If someone could give me the gist of them and the market price, that'd be great.

The items were the gnomish steam bow, the hammer of sacrifice, and a (rapier?) that allowed you to dimension door as a free action a certain number of times per day after striking a foe.

Isida, I want to finish this character up tonight, but we'll see how it goes. Is there anything blatantly out of order with the stuff I posted earlier? I do intend to spend my remaining gold now, so it'll be much more of a hassle to redo the equipment list after this point, since I won't have that buffer.

 

[Isida Kep'Tukari]

Nothing too blatant. Honestly, I just want this to be fun, and I don't want to have to nit-pick everyone's character sheet. Put up your stuff, and if you think it will make me cry, pick something else. We start Thursday at the latest.