Origins of the Demon Princes

[Voadam]

I believe Geryon in his D&D version is inspired by Dante's Inferno as are numerous devils (malebranche, etc.) from 1e.

 

[teitan]

Probably *blech*The Da Vinci Code*blech*

Nope, the Discovery Channel had a special on the Knights Templar that went over the meaning of Baphomet and the possibilities and they concluded that it would have been Sophia. This was in 1997. Before that I became involved in a couple of Templar groups, not orders but people interested in Templarism. I was involved in a Templar Order though, not the real Templars of course but I was heavily involved in the Ordo Templi Orientis until 1998. The cypher used in the special was one known to have been heavily used by the Templars from surviving documents etc. of the time period.

Da Vinci Code was a fun book but I would hardly consider it a guide to "true" Gnostic thought and principles, but it has some great clues. Mary ain't the Grail but June Cleaver is, as well as Joanie Cunningham.

Jason

 

[tarchon]

As for Demogorgon, I would suspect it's a combination of Demiurge (Demiourgos) with the Greek Gorgon, the three mythological sisters that included Medusa.

Not a combination so much - the speculation is that someone, either a copyist or perhaps Boccaccio had difficulty making the word out and, not being familiar with demiurgus (it probably occurred in a Latin MS, though it could have been in Greek characters), attempted to work out the component morphemes. Some of the attributes ascribed to Demogorgon by Boccaccio would accord with that theory. He explains the absence of the name in classical sources as being due to a superstitious dread of it, and therefore he associates a number of classical references to unnamed chthonic gods with Demogorgon.

 

[ruleslawyer]

Nope, the Discovery Channel had a special on the Knights Templar that went over the meaning of Baphomet and the possibilities and they concluded that it would have been Sophia. This was in 1997. Before that I became involved in a couple of Templar groups, not orders but people interested in Templarism. I was involved in a Templar Order though, not the real Templars of course but I was heavily involved in the Ordo Templi Orientis until 1998. The cypher used in the special was one known to have been heavily used by the Templars from surviving documents etc. of the time period.

A footnote to my GF's senior thesis (she's read much of the Nag Hammadi Codex, in Coptic) seems to support this too.

 

[Nightfall]

Orcus' origin?

He came to me and told me "If you wanna be the Sage, support me and Necromancer Games!"

So I did. Now look at me!!

 

[ivocaliban]

Not a combination so much - the speculation is that someone, either a copyist or perhaps Boccaccio had difficulty making the word out and, not being familiar with demiurgus (it probably occurred in a Latin MS, though it could have been in Greek characters), attempted to work out the component morphemes. Some of the attributes ascribed to Demogorgon by Boccaccio would accord with that theory. He explains the absence of the name in classical sources as being due to a superstitious dread of it, and therefore he associates a number of classical references to unnamed chthonic gods with Demogorgon.

Thanks for the information. This link seems to further clarify matters: http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Demogorgon

 

[hong]

Not a combination so much - the speculation is that someone, either a copyist or perhaps Boccaccio had difficulty making the word out and, not being familiar with demiurgus (it probably occurred in a Latin MS, though it could have been in Greek characters), attempted to work out the component morphemes. Some of the attributes ascribed to Demogorgon by Boccaccio would accord with that theory. He explains the absence of the name in classical sources as being due to a superstitious dread of it, and therefore he associates a number of classical references to unnamed chthonic gods with Demogorgon.

There's nothing quite like a nice ham 'n cheese toasted boccaccio, let me say now.

 

[tarchon]

Thanks for the information. This link seems to further clarify matters: http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Demogorgon

I think the source it relies upon is too hasty in dismissing the misreading theory. I was going to give some compelling arguments why a novel coinage is unlikely for an ineffable name and a misreading probable, but it turns out my local college library has a copy of In Statii Thebaida Commentum*, which I'd been looking for for years. The recensor, Sweeny, takes δημιουργόν as the correct reading after a number of scholars. The MSS have "demoirgon" and "demogorgon" in Latin letters.
Lactantius' comment to lines 516-517 of the Thebaid in Sweeny's recension reads:

dicit [autem] deum δημιουργόν, cuius scire non licet nomen. infiniti autem philosophorum <et> magorum [Persae] etiam confirmant [aut] reuera esse praeter hos deos cognitos qui coluntur in templis alium principem et maximum dominum, ceterorum numinum ordinatorem, de cuius genere sint soli Sol atque Luna.

"He's saying the god Demiourgos, whose name he was not permitted to know. Unrestricted ones, however, among the philosophers <and> magi <of Persia> also confirm [him] in fact to be the other prince and greatest lord before those known gods who are tended in the temples, ordainer of all other supernatural powers, from whose race alone are the Sun and Moon."

And it runs on for another 30 lines. But I'd say it's fairly obvious that Lactantius is talking about the Demiurge.

*Lactantii Placidi in Statii Thebaida commentum. Anonymi in Statii Achilleida commentum. Fulgentii ut fingitur Planciadis super Thebaiden commentariolum recensuit Robertus Dale Sweeney, Stuttgart : Teubner, 1997, p. 295