Overuse of monsters and magic.

[Valiant]

Ever notice how when ever a monster is overused or becomes too common it makes it seem less "monstery". For instance, the overuse of Dragons (everyone having one to ride on in our high level games) turned dragons (once a cool creature bringing images of Smog into ones mind) into little more then domestic flying battle horses. After that we never thought of Dragons the same.

Same with magic. Once we started letting PCs buy magic (to eat up their GPs) we ended up devaluating the rare pieces we found adventuring. Ho hum was what we felt.

The same can be said for game settings where continual light spells light entire dungeons or even city streets. Once magic becomes as common as modern technology, its no longer "magic" in practicality.

Or do you disagree with this assessment?

 

[Iron Captain]

I strongly agree. Magic and Monsters should be rare and wonderful.

In my games magic isn't common and the few magic users often have to face fear and respect in equal shares.

 

[Planeswalker Maloran]

Personally, I like the approach where very low-level magic is common, but high-level magic is much harder to find. For instance, you could find a +1 sword in a weapon shop in any decent city. You could find a +1 flaming sword in a large city. You might (possibly) be able to find a +1 keen flaming burst scimitar in the nation's capitol, with a good Gather Information check and a few well-placed bribes (that might cost almost as much as the sword itself). Things like everburning torches are commonly available, but still far too expensive to light a city with them. A city or dungeon lit with continual light spells is reserved for the ruins of the ever-popular ancient super-magical civilization (where magic did serve the same role as modern technology).

 

[Tarek]

Yes, I have noticed this.

It's something that the designers of 3e didn't "get" when they decided to balance the game around the concept of adventurers having the "appropriate wealth" for their level.

It's something that Living Greyhawk stumbled over for a while, literally allowing anyone to purchase anything they could afford for about a year... before they finally sat down and said "If you haven't seen it, you can't buy it."

Magic that loses its rarity loses its aura of the fantastic. When mages can throw around spells and magic effects at will, their spells lose their aura of mystery and power.

And it's hard to keep that sense of mystery, since the only people who have never encountered these things before are people who are completly new to gaming, period. Never played a computer game, never went to a movie, never watched Cable TV...

That's probably the hardest thing, keeping that sense of the fantastic.

 

[Asmor]

So invent something new! Magic lost its kick? Throw in Airships! Airships now passé? How about giff who ride psychic tyranosaurs!

Is it an arms race of craziness? Perhaps. Is that bad? IMHO, not at all.

However, if you want magic and dragons to be rare and fantastic... Make them rare and fantastic! It's your game to play as you will, and if you keep dragon encounters to a minimum, and have lots of plot and emotion invested in the encounter, even the most jaded players will respond.

It's all in the presentation.

 

[Treebore]

Its true, and its not true. I have found the key is to make it still feel hard earned. Then it remains valued. It is also why I have very slow level progression. Players enjoy it more, appreciate it more, it doesn't become "normal", its an accomplishment to feel proud of. I have had younger players literally cry tears of joy because they finally levelled.

So if you still make it feel "hard earned" it keeps its mystique.

 

[messy]

with magic, definitely agree. once magic becomes commonplace, purchasable, or ordinary, then it ceases to be "magic."

with monsters, not so much. make them dangerous, menacing, or unpredictable, and they can still rock no matter how many times they are used.

messy

 

[Geoff Watson]

The problem with "magical" magic (ie mysterious) is that if you have PC spellcasters you have to have rules for magic which makes it known and not mysterious.

Geoff.

 

[shilsen]

Or do you disagree with this assessment?

I disagree, or moe precisely, I disagree with how unilateral your assertions are. As a couple of people have already pointed out, while overuse can make magic and monsters mundane, that's not necessarily so. It's highly dependent on the presentation, as Asmor noted, and since there are many different monsters and various kinds of magic, one has a huge palette to work with, if one chooses to do so.

For example, as you noted, having lots of dragon encounters can make them feel mundane. But if there are many different kinds of dragons, and - in my estimation - even more importantly, if the specific dragon encounters the PCs have are with dragons which have a unique personality and/or significantly different abilities from dragons they have met before (which is very easy to do, what with feats, templates and the like), they're a whole lot less likely to consider it just another dragon.

Similarly, there is a certain degree of magic that players/PCs will have significant familiarity with. You mention buying magic, but one doesn't have to go that far. Just the fact that the majority of the classes in the game have some spellcasting ability means there's a lot of magic the PCs have at their fingertips. Is a wizard going to be fascinated by how awesomely exciting his fireball is when he's cast it the 20th time? I think not. But the wizard who casts fireball will still have many spells he hasn't got access to or seen in effect, and their appearance in the game (esp. if used creatively by a DM) can be much more interesting. Similarly, I fully expect that the PC who bought a +1 sword yesterday or recovered a dozen +1 swords from monsters in the course of his adventures isn't likely to find it exciting, nor will he turn a hair when he sees continual light spells light up a street if he's seen it many times before. But when he runs into a magical lamp in an insane dragon's tower that not only can illuminate the shadows of creatures that passed through an area within the last 24 hrs but also allow one to gain visions of the future at the risk of permanent insanity, I doubt he views it the same as a magical streetlamp. And the existence of the magical streetlamp doesn't make the dragon's magical lamp seem any the less magical.

In short, while your basic principle may have some truth to it, I think your overall assessment is significantly flawed.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

No DM, no matter how fiendishly miserly, can maintain the mystery of a +2 sword or a Potion of Flying when the party Wizard can transform your enemies in glowing dust (Disintegrate) and the party Cleric can pull the dead into the land of the living out of thin air (Ressurect).

You can have magic shops or not. It does not really matter.

At every character power level, there are certain kinds of things that will be perceived as "minor magics". And certain things will be perceived as "way cool".

As long as the way cool stuff feels earned, making much of an effort to keep the PCs away from the lesser stuff is pointless.

"We saved the city from a hoard of Vampire Frost Giants, and this stupid high priest of Pelor cannot help me find a way to get a better sword or scare up a few potions with my mountain of gold? Boy, this is one lame universe I am living in."