Pain-in-the-a** Players

[3catcircus]

What do you do about them? I've a group set in the Forgotten Realms that I originally was a player in and now they want me to DM. Fine - but how do I go about developing the campaign without getting angry at them when they have the following attitudes/statements (past and present.) Right away (before I even take over from the current DM), the demands and caveats and conditions start.

"We want swashbuckling adventures *and* to travel to Kara-Tur and fight samurai and ninja." (Since when did an ocean appear in The Hordelands? We're in Thesk right now - you can either *go west* and have swashbuckling adventures or *go east* to hit Kara-Tur.)

"We don't want you to play your PC as an NPC when you take over as DM because it overshadows the rest of us!" (Ok... so who is gonna be the rogue?)

"We don't need a rogue - just don't send us into places full of traps."

"No desert adventures." (Not my fault they didn't heed my advice to trade their full plate for light armor prior to setting off into the desert when I attempted to run Desert of Desolation a few months ago.)

"You make the encounters too tough." (Not my fault they didn't buy things like tanglefoot bags and alchemist's fire when I ran them through UK2 and they didn't have magic weapons and complained about fighting the perytons instead of using some brains, improvising, adapting and overcoming...)

"You don't make things fair." (I'm not here to spoon-feed you the adventure - think instead of whining - related to the Desert of Desolation module, above, when I refused to concede to their frustrated demand to "Just let us out of this damn maze!!!" It wasn't until, *finally* one of them had the brains to climb up and out of the maze after entering a set of rooms that allow this. God forbid they actually (gasp) draw a map!?!?!)

"We don't want your character because he is evil" (Stated when I, as a PC rather than a DM, used Summon Monster to summon a demon - which we needed to fight what we were fighting.)

"You are a b*****d and this isn't right." (Loud complaints when I refused to give one player any XP for an encounter in which his Paladin of Tyr purposely killed fleeing women and children (granted, they were xvarts, but still), clearly against the whole idea of a Good character - who *at the most* should have only subdued them.)

Any suggestions, other than refusing to DM?

 

[kolikeos]

this sounds like me and the other player in our group. our dm has learnd to accept that.

 

[Treebore]

Don't DM. Make them do it, or find another group who knows what adventuring means.

 

[kolikeos]

Don't DM. Make them do it, or find another group who knows what adventuring means.

finding a new group is not always as easy as it sounds

 

[Treebore]

finding a new group is not always as easy as it sounds

No it isn't easy, but so very worth it when you do.

 

[Mouseferatu]

finding a new group is not always as easy as it sounds

True. But the bottom line is, this is supposed to be fun.

Not playing is better than playing with jerks who are going to ruin your fun. Or even to playing with people who aren't jerks who are going to ruin your fun. If your fun is ruined, the game becomes worse than meaningless. It becomes a chore, and that's the last thing gaming should be.

Tell them to either accept the way you DM or have someone else DM. There's a difference between compromise--an art every DM should master--and being bullied.

 

[fafhrd]

What happened to the last DM? Burnout? Seems likely if the DMs in your group are simultaneously cowed and irked by the players. If you have a group of players that simply must play (i.e. fiends) then the DM has all the power he needs. You can dictate how its going to be and if they give you grief, suggest that they run the game and see how painful it can be. If, however, you are the glue that holds it together and they will just drop the game rather than make amends, you're screwed and you may be better off finding another group more suited to your style.

 

[kolikeos]

Not playing is better than playing with jerks who are going to ruin your fun. Or even to playing with people who aren't jerks who are going to ruin your fun. If your fun is ruined, the game becomes worse than meaningless. It becomes a chore, and that's the last thing gaming should be.

agreed

 

[billd91]

<snip>
"We want swashbuckling adventures *and* to travel to Kara-Tur and fight samurai and ninja." (Since when did an ocean appear in The Hordelands? We're in Thesk right now - you can either *go west* and have swashbuckling adventures or *go east* to hit Kara-Tur.)

"We don't want you to play your PC as an NPC when you take over as DM because it overshadows the rest of us!" (Ok... so who is gonna be the rogue?)

"We don't need a rogue - just don't send us into places full of traps."

"No desert adventures." (Not my fault they didn't heed my advice to trade their full plate for light armor prior to setting off into the desert when I attempted to run Desert of Desolation a few months ago.)

"You make the encounters too tough." (Not my fault they didn't buy things like tanglefoot bags and alchemist's fire when I ran them through UK2 and they didn't have magic weapons and complained about fighting the perytons instead of using some brains, improvising, adapting and overcoming...)

"You don't make things fair." (I'm not here to spoon-feed you the adventure - think instead of whining - related to the Desert of Desolation module, above, when I refused to concede to their frustrated demand to "Just let us out of this damn maze!!!" It wasn't until, *finally* one of them had the brains to climb up and out of the maze after entering a set of rooms that allow this. God forbid they actually (gasp) draw a map!?!?!)

<snip>

On one hand, this is good. You get to know what sorts of adventures they want. Swashbuckling action and a trip to Kara-Tur.
But they sound like they're really being whining, demanding weasels about it.
As far as desert adventures and going to Kara-tur, don't they decided where it is they want to go adventure? Sure, the DM has some input by laying out adventure hooks. But if they don't want a desert adventure, they don't need to go on one. If they want to go to Kara-Tur, time to spend some time planning the expedition.
As far as traps and all that, don't listen to them. If they don't want to be prepared for them, that's their tough luck. Now, that said, I wouldn't devise a trap-laden adventure where a rogue is a necessity for them without there being plenty of warning that traps are an issue. Then if they want to take on the adventure, they can either get ahold of some Find Traps magic or hire a rogue for some contract work.
I generally agree with them not wanting you to play your old PC as an NPC. If they want to hire someone, they can do so and you should generate that character afresh. That removes any expectation of favoritism in this case.
As far as being too tough, hey, adventuring's a dangerous business. If you can't handle it, get out of the profession. This is, however, probably going to be your biggest problem. Sounds like you have impatient, immature, whiny players not willing to put in the work it takes to be a successful player. I don't know how you're going to fight that other than refusing to DM and being a better player when you're on the PC side of the DM's screen.

 

[MerakSpielman]

Just show up for the next session and say, "OK, you're in Thesk. What do you do now?"

And go with it.

Sounds like they want a player-led campaign, where they go wherever they want whenever they want. Just get a few adventures ready and modify 'em to fit into wherever the PCs end up. Change the monsters to be whatever it is that works in that area. Try not to let on when they hit a specific, prepared adventure - that way they think they're calling all the shots.