Pathfinder 1E Paizo Annoucement!

[billd91]

But it is making that split worse. There are a number of people that were willing to go whichever way Paizo went. Paizo could have brought more people over to 4e. Instead, they're preventing people from switching.

They are not preventing anyone from switching at all. Rather, they're providing support for people not interested in switching. That prevents nothing.

Could a committed and involved Paizo have brought more people to 4e? Probably, particularly if they were still in charge of Dragon and Dungeon. Paizo makes good stuff, there's not much doubt about that. But they have their own choices to make and if they feel they can thrive by doing something else, more power to them. They have no responsibility to WotC to support 4e or to support 4e fans unless they choose to take that responsibility on themselves.

 

[billd91]

Not all that quickly.

Keep in mind the PRPG Guide is due out in 18 months. That means they've basically committed to 2 years at a minimum. And since they're quickly locking up not just the anti-4e crowd but the "YOU'LL PRY THIRD EDITION FROM MY COLD DEAD FINGERS" crowd, that's going to make switching even more difficult.

Switching whole product lines, sure that's tough. But what's to stop them from coming out with a 4e product? I suspect they'll be able to do that as quickly as they can commission and crank out any other product for 3.5 now. I also strongly suspect that some Paizo people will be picking up 4e and playing it fairly regularly, so it won't be like they have absolutely no experience with the system if (or more likely when) they decide to make some 4e products.

The lead time for making a whole adventure path make switching to 4e now prohibitive, yes. But that's not the same as coming up with a line of independent modules like the Gamemastery line for 4e.

 

[vagabundo]

Not all that quickly.

Keep in mind the PRPG Guide is due out in 18 months. That means they've basically committed to 2 years at a minimum. And since they're quickly locking up not just the anti-4e crowd but the "YOU'LL PRY THIRD EDITION FROM MY COLD DEAD FINGERS" crowd, that's going to make switching even more difficult.

If those crowds are not big enough to allow paizo to eat, then paizo, assuming they want to eat, will change tacks. Projects will be cancelled or, IMO more likely, resources shifted so that dual 3.5e-4e pathfinder will be released.

Paizo will not support this to the death, they have made a decision for the short term (1/2 years is business short term) but the numbers will ultimately decide their direction.

My guess is that they will slowly shift to 4e over the next 1/2 years, they will follow the profits. They have committed themselves to the 3.5e market only if it can sustain them. They are unlikely to put it in their press releases, but I'd be surprised if they do not already have an emergency business plan if the wind on this tack dies.

 

[Silenttimo]

So Paizo decided to betray 4E?
They won't get my money anymore.
I'm just moving my Paizo bookmark from the RPG/D&D folder into the RPG/Others folder.

This is harsh !

They did not decide to "betray" 4E.

They think that there is going a market for people (like myself) who would like to stay 3.5 (I have spent lots of money on 3.5 and don't want to see those wasted).
They think they waited too long for the GSL, and that the GSL is too restrictive so that tweaking things for their Golarion / PF world will be too difficult to do.

Indeed, they make their own game, just like hackmaster, C&C, and not counting people who stayed basic D&D, 1st or 2nd Ed.

I think you are over-reacting : they make great products, people will propose conversion for PF products, just like it is possible to find old modules converted here on EnWorld, and stop buying their products may be a bad idea: after all, they did a hell of a good job on their D&D products, and I guess they'll go on.

Good luck Paizo !

 

[Baka no Hentai]

My take is 10%, maybe as much as 20%. Whoever at WoTC caused the GSL to not be ready at GenCon 2007 is really the main cause of this. The GSL and keeping Paizo in the D&D camp should have been one of their highest priorities.

I seriously doubt these numbers. I dont believe that 10% of the current D&D market even knows what Paizo is.

As I said in another thread... I only learned of Paizo after coming to the ENWorld boards a couple of months ago in search of 4E information. Without a strong brand identity in hobby-shops and other areas outside of the forum-world, there is absolutely no way that Paizo could pull those kind of numbers.

In fact, I doubt that even 10% of the people who are not going to switch to 4E know enough about Paizo to jump ship from 3.0/3.5/Any other OGL company.

 

[catsclaw]

They are not preventing anyone from switching at all. Rather, they're providing support for people not interested in switching. That prevents nothing.

I didn't mean prevent in the "bar the door and point a shotgun at your head" meaning. I meant prevent in the "I was going to buy 4e, but then I heard Paizo was coming out with PRPG, so now I'm not."

And that they certainly have done. Again, they did what they thought made the most sense for them. But as someone who is thoroughly sick of 3.5 at this point, I went from a Pathfinder subscriber to a non-subscriber on the announcement. And if I can't find groups to play 4e, or 4e flops, I'm not switching to PRPG. I'll find another game, or quit playing entirely. To the extent that Paizo has made that more likely, I'm disappointed.

 

[FickleGM]

[A Silent Wail] My hat of PafthinderGPR Know No Limits [/A Silent Wail]

Okay, all kidding aside...this move is intriguing and I am interested in what the final product will look like. I am a current fan of SWSE, and am pro-4e, but I don't like everything that I've seen from 4e. I wonder if Paizo's product will be something that I like more...

Anyway, I have to go move some bookmarks or do something else equally earth-shattering.

 

[Taluron]

From my brief skim of the rules, the only thing I don't like is, once again, no skill points -- but I'm "Getting" that I'm the only person on the planet which DID like them.

Just have to say - No, you're not.

My group my often plays skill-based adventures/campaigns (thief/rouge campaigns are common)

We prefer skill points.

 

[BryonD]

I seriously doubt these numbers. I dont believe that 10% of the current D&D market even knows what Paizo is.

If you don't even know who Paizo is, then I tend to doubt you have a good feel for the marketplace.

 

[Wyrd]

I look for more of this to come about, hopefully not fracturing the market too much. WOTC dropped the ball by not having the license ready, businesses have lead times for products, anyone who is in business has to make choices based on many factors, an unknown license for an unknown game is not going to be a safe investment.

Add to this the fact that many of Paizo's employee's have likely seen a lot more of 4e than we have, and perhaps even have a general idea of how the new license will look like, perhaps this is the best bet for them to avoid a bad license for a game that may or may not be a viable product.

The only reason I purchased 3e was because of the RPGA living games, my home game runs my own set of house rules that is part classic D&D, part 1e, 2e, 3e, and whatever other material seems to fit and make the game run better, I will do the same with 4e, borrow the parts I like, dump the rest, though at this point from what I have seen, I already have good rules in place for what 4e does well, and better rules in place for the rest.

I am trying to keep an open mind, but it looks more and more like WOTC has been eaten by the corporate monster that is Hasboro, and the gamers are gone.