Pathfinder 1E Paizo no longer publishing Dungeon and Dragon

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

This from the "Are you saying they're LYING???" person? Funny. :\

-The Gneech

That does not invalidate his point.

How in any hell can you justify calling people a traitor to a hobby? Everything about that is stupid and wrong and DOES represent badly on our hobby AND on ENWorld as a whole.

 

[daemonslye]

I suppose I subscribe to the philosophy that "the customer comes first"; I work for a company where that is not only a principle but we also maintain a legal obligation with every customer to act in their best interests above those of the company.

If the leadership at Wizards had done their due diligence, on their customers behalf, they perhaps would have reviewed their model of the outcome.

Yeah, it's just two magazines. But, those magazines support an industry. Folks that are not so, er, online, lets say, get most of their info on new products from the magazines. I game with 15 or so players and only I subscribe. That said, there is a fight for the magazine when new at every table. Many products highlighted in print (even if a simple ad) will now never be seen. Scoff if you will - Time will tell.

But still - it's just two magazines. Why take such a hard line? I suppose because the mere thought that a "suit" in Corporate can turn our game on it's head (30+ years in print forms some attachment) really wakes you up. I thought Wizards might be populated with folks rather like us - Gamers, professionals, educated (or at least well-read), that support each other. Why else do we play such a "social" game?

The thought that because "Dungeon Magazine" upstages poorly designed products for better value, it should be "axed" along with Dragon, 30+ years not withstanding... Customer sentiment aside... Well, that really pisses me off. It makes me think that the dudes working for Wizards are not like me at all; They are "sugar water sales execs" creating an illusion of a social network (the reason this game has any popularity) only to pump out cookie cutter book after book.

Others have pointed that out before this change. I chose not to believe them. Now, however, I am awake.

Here's the deal - if I choose to be a consumer in products I can believe in makes me an "extreme nerd" then so be it.

This is a Big Deal guys. It's not just about the two magazines. It's about the philosophy about how the company regards us consumers overall.

~D

 

[Erik Mona]

Out of curiosity, did you expect this announcement to stir up this much animosity?

Yes.

--Erik

 

[BryonD]

Okay, it's time this was said.

People who feel like you need to get a life.

Seriously. You are the reason our hobby is portrayed as composed of obsessive, socially deprived, extreme nerds who live in their parents basements and eventually find their ways into steam tunnels in a psychotic break.

It's just a couple of magazines that are going online. That's all this is about. Nobody is a "disgusting traitor to our collective conscience". Nobody should quit their jobs, leaving their families without an income, because your precious magazines are going online instead of in print.

Christ. Get a friggen life! Get outdoors! Take a break from the obsession. It's just a game. Just a hobby. There were just some mags with fantasy stuff in them that isn't real.

Amen!!

Unless you work for Paizo, this news isn't remotely near worthy of the absurd overreaction it has received. And Paizo clearly is not reacting this way but instead, very much to their credit, has shown a praiseworthy level headed adaptation.

Hell, I'm quite disappointed that a print Dragon magazine will be no more (for the time being at least... ). But seriously, even if WotC had made this choice out of hate and disdain for the tiny ENWorld corner of their sales base, it still wouldn't be that big a deal. I shudder to think how poorly some of the posters here would handle it if something truly bad did happen to them. Because if this ranks as a kick in your gut, then you have led a highly blessed and lucky life so far.

 

[d12]

write them!

Let me just add to those who have mentioned emailing WoTC about this. If you are unhappy about this decision, then email them. Don't be insulting but be direct. Tell them which magazines you subscribe to or purchase. Tell them (briefly) why you like to get your Dungeon/Dragon content in the mail, in a paper-based magazine. Somewhere in the email, urge them to change their decision and resume publication. State this directly; don't hint around. Indicate your willingness and desire to continue getting the product you love. Make sure the subject line says something about "Dungeon" and/or "Dragon." Sign your email with your first and last name and your hometown and state (at least).

 

[BryonD]

This is a Big Deal guys. It's not just about the two magazines. It's about the philosophy about how the company regards us consumers overall.

No it is not.

It is about a company deciding that there is a better way to market their property and moving forward with a plan to get there.

 

[Maggan]

I suppose I subscribe to the philosophy that "the customer comes first";

The problem is ... should every one of WotC:s customers come first?

If that'd be the case, the company would be paralysed with indecision. What to support, and what not to support?

For even though it might feel like it at times, most gamers don't agree on what they want WotC to do, or even what they would like WotC to do.

WotC can't put every customer first. Not in a practical sense. What they can do is put groups of customers first, and make whatever decisions they believe will serve the customer groups they focus on and the company itself best.

/M

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

I work for a company where that is not only a principle but we also maintain a legal obligation with every customer to act in their best interests above those of the company.

What company is that?

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

The problem is ... should every one of WotC:s customers come first?

Given that there are many periodicals (The Sun, The Economist, The NY Times, The NO Times-Picayune, and the entire Guitar Player/Bass Player stable of magazines, to name but a few) that have both a print form and an online form, it is quite probable that every one of WotC's customers could have come first.

WotC had a chance to have a Win-Win situation and blew it.

What to support, and what not to support?

You support what works. You support what your customers view as a significant reason for giving you their money.

Personally, I think WotC is overestimating the popularity of e-zines. My personal experience with the 2 mags is that usually, one person in the group buys the magazine, and everyone else borrows it. While not impossible, it's a bit more difficult to do that with an e-zine.

(And, for the record, I'm no technophobe- I've been mixing computers & gaming since the mid-80s. I have always gone back to non-electronic gaming supplies & techniques. They're a supplement, not a replacement)

While Pyramid is cited as an exemplar of the shift from print to e-publishing, even that decision cost them readers. Myself, for instance.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

I suppose I subscribe to the philosophy that "the customer comes first"

But if the majority of D&D players don't buy Dragon or Dungeon...then aren't they putting the customer first, still? Just not that small portion that DOES buy.