Pal/Fist Of Razie Magic Circle Against eeevil

[Junkheap]

Ok guys a little problem we ran into yesterday

Btw Fist of raziel is a prestige calls from Exalted deeds. 1st level of the fist give a magic circle again evil(su) always active.

To cut to the chase we came upon 2 Huge fire elementals(we are lvl8)

First question:

Can i choose to supress the magic circle against evil and bring it up anytime? If i can is it a standard action, or free action full rounder? Asking this as i would have the party delay till my before my iniative(after the elemantals iniative)so that the party attacks, and i immediately bring the circle back up.

Sencond Q:

The magic circle prevents the elementals from doing anything to me and ne1 with 10 feet of me. If someone else attacks the elemental that was within the cirlcle(party members) will it bring the circle down? Does this change is i(pal/Fist) attack it?

Part 2 of second q:

If it does come up, does it come back immediately, and is that elemental immune to it now or is he still prevented from touching ne1 physically? I am asking this because it is the same spell that is constantly up, but we broke it and brought it back up. The fire elemental does not have SR so he cant do anything with regards to the spell.

 

[rich]

aren't elementals neutral, not evil?

 

[Hypersmurf]

aren't elementals neutral, not evil?

Presumably, they're summoned or conjured elementals, which are hedged out like any other summoned or conjured non-good creatures by a MCaE.

If someone else attacks the elemental that was within the cirlcle(party members) will it bring the circle down?

Well, Magic Circle says "All creatures within the area gain the effects of a protection from evil spell, and no nongood summoned creatures can enter the area either."

Protection from Evil says "The protection against contact by summoned creatures ends if the warded creature makes an attack against or tries to force the barrier against the blocked creature."

Now, if each creature benefits from PfE, then presumably each creature can forfeit the protection against contact by summoned creatures if they attack.

But it becomes very important to know if it's effectively one PfE affecting multiple creatures, or multiple PfEs, one per creature. If the former, one attack can bring down everyone's protection. If the latter, an attack only brings down the protection for the attacker.

However, the prohibition on nongood summoned creatures is an effect of the MCaE separate from the PfE effect... so even if an attacker forfeits the protection against contact (for himself or for everyone, depending on interpretation), the Fire Elemental is still hedged outside the area of the MCaE.

-Hyp.

 

[Junkheap]

Presumably, they're summoned or conjured elementals, which are hedged out like any other summoned or conjured non-good creatures by a MCaE.



Well, Magic Circle says "All creatures within the area gain the effects of a protection from evil spell, and no nongood summoned creatures can enter the area either."

Protection from Evil says "The protection against contact by summoned creatures ends if the warded creature makes an attack against or tries to force the barrier against the blocked creature."

Now, if each creature benefits from PfE, then presumably each creature can forfeit the protection against contact by summoned creatures if they attack.

But it becomes very important to know if it's effectively one PfE affecting multiple creatures, or multiple PfEs, one per creature. If the former, one attack can bring down everyone's protection. If the latter, an attack only brings down the protection for the attacker.

However, the prohibition on nongood summoned creatures is an effect of the MCaE separate from the PfE effect... so even if an attacker forfeits the protection against contact (for himself or for everyone, depending on interpretation), the Fire Elemental is still hedged outside the area of the MCaE.

-Hyp.

Its only 1 effect by me the pal/fist that covers everyone with 10 ft radius, thats always active. So by what you are saying, i can attack the elemantal(ranged and not melee) and he cannot do anything to me as he cannot resist the spell due to him not having SR?

What happens when say i fight a summoned/nongood creature with SR and bypasses the MCaE. Does he have to do it every round or only once for the spell?

Man this is too

 

[Hypersmurf]

So by what you are saying, i can attack the elemantal(ranged and not melee) and he cannot do anything to me as he cannot resist the spell due to him not having SR?

Well, it's similar to fighting a Colossal Scorpion if you have a Fly spell.

The scorpion can't fly, and has no ranged attacks; as long as you don't come within reach, it can't touch you.

Or fighting the fire elemental while standing waist-deep in a river. If it can't reach you, it can't fight you... but you can shoot at it or cast spells at it with impunity.

What happens when say i fight a summoned/nongood creature with SR and bypasses the MCaE. Does he have to do it every round or only once for the spell?

"Check spell resistance only once for any particular casting of a spell or use of a spell-like ability. If spell resistance fails the first time, it fails each time the creature encounters that same casting of the spell. Likewise, if the spell resistance succeeds the first time, it always succeeds. If the creature has voluntarily lowered its spell resistance and is then subjected to a spell, the creature still has a single chance to resist that spell later, when its spell resistance is up."

-Hyp.

 

[GakToid]

Fist of Raziel ability:

Magic Circle (Su): A 1st-level fist of Raziel is constantly surrounded by a magic circle against evil effect, as the spell cast by a cleric of the fist's total character level.

SRD:

Protection from Evil:
The protection against contact by summoned creatures ends if the warded creature makes an attack against or tries to force the barrier against the blocked creature.

Magic Circle against Evil:
All creatures within the area gain the effects of a protection from evil spell, and no nongood summoned creatures can enter the area either.

Can a Fist of Raziel willingly suppress the Magic Circle?

If the "protection against contact by summoned creatures ends" does this mean the Magic Circle has ended or just that aspect of it?

If the Magic Circle ends because the Fist of Raziel "forces the barrier against the blocked creature", does it resume automatically or does the Fist of Raziel need to spend a standard action to activate it? If automatically, then when?

Can a Fist of Raziel engage in melee combat with a summoned evil outsider? What are the affects of attempting to do this?

-Gak Toid

 

[Count Arioch the 28t]

I would say that moving within the circle's radius breaks the spell, but the fist of raziel can raise it again as a standard action, however, doing so when the outsiders are withing 10' of you would break it again, as you cannot use abjurations as a battering ram, if I'm not mistaken.

 

[Junkheap]

But the major problem is, is the MCaE considered one casting period. So once i gain the first level of fist of raziel that is it, it has been casted., the effect is permanent. If i force a creature into the circle, he is immune to the effect forever, or until he dies. Me bringing it back up or backing up beyond 10 feet doesnt protect me anymore, just like a creature with SR would be immune to my MCaE if he makes the SR check.

Also again can you suppress SU? Can i bring it back up anytime?