Paladin/Battlemind Help

[Neonchameleon]

The first trick with Paladins is that you need either strength or charisma. The strength build is more or less single target - the charisma one can mark everyone in sight (or rather by level 2 can mark everyone in burst 3 for two rounds) and debuffs.

But to me the biggest thing to decide is what your character concept is and build to that.

 

[Salukiknight]

Understood, the above might work for the strength build. Below is similar to the orignal block with some minor changes. Level 4 points in chat & con.

STR 13
CON 18
DEX 11
INT 11
WIS 16
CHA 17

The concept is the best possible defender, but I would like multiple targeting.

 

[Salukiknight]

I'm still stuck on feats, Half considered taking "Versatile Channeler" and getting Rebuke Undead via Inovker.

 

[Salukiknight]

Ok, I have him built in the character builder. Lemme show you what I got.

Level 6 Dwarf Paladin

STR 13
CON 18
DEX 11
INT 11
WIS 18
CHA 17

Level 1 Traded LoH for Ardent Vow
At-Wills- Ardent Strike, Virtuous Strike
Encounter (1) - Valorous Smite
Daily (1) - Majestic Halo
Utility (2) - Call of Challenge
Encounter (3) - Righteous Smite
Daily (5) - Unyielding Faith
Utility (6) - Aspect of Domination

Feats
1 - Dwarven Weapon Proficiency
2 - Versatile Channeler (Invoker: Rebuke Undead)
4 - Battlewise (wisdom instead of dex on initiative)
6 - Virtuous Recovery

Likely Dwarven Plate, a Heavy Shield, and a Craghammer for basic gear.
Is there an axe version of the Craghammer? (Superior Versatile Axe)
I'd welcome any suggestions on gear.

 

[Neonchameleon]

The concept is the best possible defender, but I would like multiple targeting.

There's no such thing as "The best possible defender". There's only a "Best possible defender at [aspect of defending]". For instance the Charisma-paladin is the best at marking large areas and can punish everyone who attacks someone else - but on the downside Charisma-paladin mark punishment is weak, especially at high levels. The best defender at single target lockdown is almost certainly the Fighter (Weaponmaster), while a Knight in Defend the Line Stance with the World Serpent's Grasp feat can hold an entire battleline extremely effectively and is no slouch at damage - but has few options and you may find is too samey.

Ultimately "defender" isn't a character concept. "Holy warrior in shining armour who challenges the whole battle" is. So it "Mr T with a broadsword" or "Grizzled veteran of a thousand battlefields, protecting more impetuous youth". So is "Bezerk warrior who leads from the front, protecting his allies". (This is why I have problems with the Battlemind as a concept - I can see the room for a psion-empath defender who forces a feedback loop on his enemies to feel the pain they are inflicting, but that ain't the battlemind).

And because 4e is pretty well balanced, if there is no other defender in the party you will be far and away the best defender and extremely useful no matter which defender class you pick. If there is another defender then both of you will be the best there is at what you do but that will be slightly different.

That said, before Level 7 (Lightning Rush) the Battlemind is a weak defender and the Cavalier has its issues preventing shifts.

Edit: On the build, it looks pretty solid in terms of powers and the stat spread is useful. I'm a fan of Enfeebling Strike as your second At Will (as well as the essential MBA one) so you have serious single target lockdown. On the other hand DWP may be awesome but I don't like most of your other feat choices unless you're in a seriously undead heavy world. Your Channel Divinity will be useful whatever happens so spending a feat on something that situational isn't the choice I'd make. You don't have Expertise of any sort - and a multiclass feat is always very good value. (The superior versatile axe just does d12 damage). For gear are you using inherent bonusses?

 

[Grimmjow]

Level 1 Feat: Hybrid Talent - Paladin Armor Procificency (Yay plate!)

Can't you just take plate spec and use hybrid talent for something else?

 

[Salukiknight]

Can't you just take plate spec and use hybrid talent for something else?

The Plate issue is done since I'm going to go full paladin.
But the problem with the plate prof feat is it requires a 15 strength. Whereas if I get it via paladin, no strength requirement.

 

[Salukiknight]

Edit: On the build, it looks pretty solid in terms of powers and the stat spread is useful. I'm a fan of Enfeebling Strike as your second At Will (as well as the essential MBA one) so you have serious single target lockdown. On the other hand DWP may be awesome but I don't like most of your other feat choices unless you're in a seriously undead heavy world. Your Channel Divinity will be useful whatever happens so spending a feat on something that situational isn't the choice I'd make. You don't have Expertise of any sort - and a multiclass feat is always very good value. (The superior versatile axe just does d12 damage). For gear are you using inherent bonusses?

Neon, thanks for all your thoughts, another player is playing a warden hybrid I believe. So I think we should be covered on defense. Channel Divinity is situational, thats why I don't like it. Can you suggest a good multiclass feat?

Battlewise I went with so I have a decent initiative modifier. I figured with a wisdom that high, battlewise will scale whereas improved initiative won't.

Virtuous Recovery, well, wisdom modifier as DR after healing. I figured that would help my longevity over something like "Toughness". I'm looking forward to getting Dwarven Durability at 11, that feat is fantastic.

 

[Salukiknight]

You don't have Expertise of any sort - and a multiclass feat is always very good value. (The superior versatile axe just does d12 damage). For gear are you using inherent bonusses?

I'm not sure how the axe/hammer game will play out with the other characters, so I expect my level 8 feat will set me into a weapon type. Gotta understand the rest of the party better first.

As for gear/inherent bonuses. I'm not sure what you mean. I'm not even sure how the DM wants me to do gear for a 6th level character. The DMG (or was it PHB1) had a section about it and talked about taking an item =Level+1, an item at =Level, an item at =Level -1, and enough gold for another item =Level.

So I'm looking at Dwarven Plate +2
A +2 Craghammer (or axe equivelant)
and a Valiant Heavy Shield.

I didn't know if anyone had opinions on the shield, +2 AC & -2 Armor Check vs Light shield at +1 AC and no ACP

Honestly I have no idea if those rules even apply, but it helps me take a look at gear and gain some understanding.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Multiclassed feats are a mixed bag. Personally, unless it's purely for RP reasons, I won't touch the ones that don't at least give you a power.* Your stats would support any number of options, though- warlock, battlemind, ardent, bard, sorcerer, invoker...maybe avenger (I can't recall if their MC is Wis or Dex based).







* I have a problem with 4Ed's stingy MC rules, so I think the "power + trains skill" format should be standard.