Paladin/Sorceror Hybrid - 3 in 1 implement/weapon?

[Otterscrubber]

Well since I am a paladin and I intend to be in melee a weapon rather than an arcane implement would be my choice. As hybrids are written a melee weapon that I can use as a holy symbol will allow me to use it for my arcane powers without having to get a feat for it. I dont know too many arcane weapons....

 

[Otterscrubber]

Also, if i have expertise with my longsword (vigilant blade which can be used as an implement), and I make an attack with it, do i get to use my expertise bonus when using my heavy blade weapon as the implement?

 

[Klaus]

Paladin/Sorcerer + Arcane Implement Proficiency (heavy blade) + Vigilant Weapon = all-in-one implement/weapon

Deva character might prefer using an Evil Undone weapon. Bramadan is another option.

 

[DracoSuave]

Also, if i have expertise with my longsword (vigilant blade which can be used as an implement), and I make an attack with it, do i get to use my expertise bonus when using my heavy blade weapon as the implement?

If you have Weapon Expertise? No.
If you have Implement Expertise? Yes, but then you can't use that bonus with Weapon attacks.

If you have Versatile Expertise? Yes, and you can use it with weapon attacks, and because you went with a heavy blade, you can select another weapon type so that you can have more selection for items. Break out the right weapon for the right job, so to speak.

 

[Argyle King]

Also, if i have expertise with my longsword (vigilant blade which can be used as an implement), and I make an attack with it, do i get to use my expertise bonus when using my heavy blade weapon as the implement?

yes

 

[Akaiku]

Paladin/Sorcerer + Arcane Implement Proficiency (heavy blade)=All in one user.

Hybrids can use any implement from either of their classes as an implement for the other. This doen't exclude implement use you got later from a feat, right? Since you can use a heavy blade as a sorcerer and you can use sorcerer implements for your paladin implement powers, you can just use any heavy blade. Like a sunblade... or a holy avenger... (Side note, holy avenger+cosmic sorceror blazing starfall is hilarious.)

 

[Aulirophile]

Paladin/Sorcerer + Arcane Implement Proficiency (heavy blade)=All in one user.

Hybrids can use any implement from either of their classes as an implement for the other. This doen't exclude implement use you got later from a feat, right? Since you can use a heavy blade as a sorcerer and you can use sorcerer implements for your paladin implement powers, you can just use any heavy blade. Like a sunblade... or a holy avenger... (Side note, holy avenger+cosmic sorceror blazing starfall is hilarious.)

Doesn't work. Hybrid rule says class implements. AIP does not make it a class implement, it makes it an implement you can use. I don't know if that is RAI, but it is RAW.

 

[Akaiku]

Doesn't work. Hybrid rule says class implements. AIP does not make it a class implement, it makes it an implement you can use. I don't know if that is RAI, but it is RAW.

Ah, my bad, must have just been a house interpretation I was using. Though, quarterstaff's d8's with staff fighting is not that bad.

 

[Argyle King]

Doesn't work. Hybrid rule says class implements. AIP does not make it a class implement, it makes it an implement you can use. I don't know if that is RAI, but it is RAW.

I disagree; I would say the feat trumps the hybrid description as a more specific rule.

AIP allows you to use a different implement with your class. For a hybrid character, both classes are 'your class.' This -to me- would mean the new implement becomes a new implement which is usable by both classes.

Alternatively, AIP allows you to use a different implement with your class; this turns whatever the new implement is into an implement which can be used by your arcane class. As such, it now becomes an implement of your class; the hybrid rules then kick in and allow you to use it with your other class as well.


edit: Consider how the monk would work as an example. Monk implements can be any weapon a monk is proficient with. So, let's say the monk takes a feat to pick up a new weapon; for sake of example, let's say Spiked Chain. The Spiked Chain now turns into a monk implement; a monk/paladin could use a spiked chain as a holy symbol.

 

[firesnakearies]

I can see how one could make a RAW argument against it, but I'd definitely allow it. It seems to fit well enough with the spirit of the rules for hybrids and the intended usefulness level of the feat.