PDFs - Does size matter?

[tarchon]

Clicking on a file so that it opens is "far more effort?"

If people think that Clicking on File|Save is a lot of effort, then saving a file as a zip and then having to click on it again, open it in a ZIP folder/window (depending on the OS), and then extract or copy it out of the ZIP into another folder is comparatively a lot of work. None of this is a big deal obviously, and saying that saving a PDF by normal means is hard is frankly a little bit of a stretch, but if we're using that as the standard of "a lot of trouble" then making me extract the PDF from a ZIP archive is also "a lot of trouble."

Or, ya know, maybe...just maybe, he's a publisher who works with RPGNow, and knows what he's talking about when he discusses the delivery software we use.

Or ya know maybe I've been downloading hundreds of PDFs a year for the last 5 years so I know what's the easiest way to do it.

 

[Emiricol]

This is one part of PDF publishing I frequently worry about. With each release I ask myself "Am I giving the customer a good product at a fair price?" It's a tough area of publishing and one I think about on an almost daily basis.

As a consumer, so far I've been quite willing to pay the cost of the original product, minus what I guestimate is a reasonble cost for printing (ie, the gross profit per unit), minus a little bit (and I do mean little) for the inconvenience of PDFs over hardcopy.

Generally this means I'm willing to pay about 50-65% of what a hardcopy costs, for a PDF. Call $15-18 for the PDF of the usual $29.95 hardcopy.

I have no idea if anyone else feels the same way. I'm also not religious about it if I really want it badly enough and don't have quite enough for the hardcopy.

 

[Emiricol]

With a single file, it doesn't save any mouse clicks though. 1 left click or 1 right click, either way, and in many cases a ZIP type prompts a save-or-open dialog (depends on your browser settings), which is actually taking one more click than if you right-mouse and save.

It saves me 1 click per item. Since that's the amount you are so far posting about, I feel this is a significant quantity

Actually it saves me about 4 clicks per item because when I hit "save" on the ZIP it just goes where I want it instead of having to click through to my downloads directory, but even ONE CLICK is clearly enough to cause a half-page conversation.

Could I do it differently? Probably, but with ZIP files I don't have to bother.



As to file sizes, the topic of this thread, I don't really care as long as I feel I'm getting a good value. Long, short, both are fine with me.

 

[tarchon]

Since the delivery system in question runs through an emailed link, the right click and save feature does not work for a lot of email clients. For example, using eudora, the link is there, either I cut and paste it into a browser window (thus having to load the 40 meg file to the browser instead of downloading it and saving it) or I click on the link and it opens a new browser window and starts the same process.

A 40 MB download takes exactly the same amount of time whether you do it through Save Link As or the browser window.

There might be a quick fix so every user can change his or her browser to not work this way, but wouldn't it just be easier to provide the files in a zip file and not have to educate the tens of thousands of buyers on how to reconfigure their browsers?

It's a quick fix on the SERVER side, so it's way easier than either of those. All you do is just associate a non-PDF MIME type (e.g. application/x-unknown) with the PDF extension, but as I've said I hardly think it's necessary anyway. I mean do you expect there are a lot of people who don't know how to use the File menu but do know how to extract files from an archive? I don't think so. My mom can barely turn on a computer, but she sure knows that if you want to save a file, you use File|Save. Give her a zip file, and she's calling me up long distance. I don't know how much time I've spent on like genealogy groups over the years with people posting things like "help! how do I view a zip file?" With XP, it's a lot easier (since the dearcher is part of the shell), but not everybody in the world has XP.

Using zip files in this technique instead opens a new browser window which then immediately prompts me with a save / run option.

So basically we've designed this whole system to suit a particular quirk of the way you personally have Eudora set up? Sorry, I think you're still on the post-hoc apologetics here. I don't for one second believe that that's the reason this is done the way it is.

I'm not even talking about RPGNow or anyone in particular (though I have downloaded ZIPs from them and been through that), but this seems to be some weird widespread practice exclusive to the RPG industry, like the zipped PDFs that WotC uses in their downloads. Nobody else in the world does this, as far as I can tell, so best I can figure it's a case of vendors copying a nonsensical practice just because it's some "industry standard." "Well, RPGNow does it so it must be the right thing to do!"
I know that people selling through RPGNet don't determine what RPGNet's policy but what I don't get is why you guys are vehemently defending it. On the one hand you say "don't blame us, we have no control" (and I wasn't blaming you) but then when I complain about it you all start busting my butt? I don't get it.

 

[Crothian]

This is one part of PDF publishing I frequently worry about. With each release I ask myself "Am I giving the customer a good product at a fair price?" It's a tough area of publishing and one I think about on an almost daily basis.

I _think_ the answer to my question is yes. At least, I hope it is.

I used to incluide price and info on if it is worth it in my reviews, but it differes so much person to person it is almost useless to know if I think a book is worth the cost. Even for me the pdf being worth such a cost will vary from month to month depending on how my other expenses and how much money I'm pulling in. Personal economics are a completed thing.

 

[Mark]

I know that people selling through RPGNet don't determine what RPGNet's policy but what I don't get is....

...that you're complaining in the wrong place. It's RPGNow.com and here is the place to voice your complaint if you want it to reach the ears of someone who might be able to do something about it -

http://forums.rpghost.com/forumdisplay.php?f=5

Personally, I just do what I need to do to use the system that is available (as Hellhound mentioned, basically, at one point). If you get them to change it, tarchon, then I'll have to change the way I do things. If you don't, then I'll continue doing what I do there now.

 

[Cyberhawk]

Personally I like the longer PDFs becuase I like the meatier books. I find the small "6 items for $1" pdfs unsatisfying. Totally a personal preference on that one.

Also I'm going to be picking up Solid! in pdf form becuase it strikes me as the right balance between size and price. (the print book is just way too skinny).

My 3 favorite PDFs so far are:
Call of Duty (fantastic flavor...love the "Martyr" feat)
Three Arrows for the King
Minions

 

[tarchon]

It saves me 1 click per item. Since that's the amount you are so far posting about, I feel this is a significant quantity

Actually it saves me about 4 clicks per item because when I hit "save" on the ZIP it just goes where I want it instead of having to click through to my downloads directory, but even ONE CLICK is clearly enough to cause a half-page conversation.

Could I do it differently? Probably, but with ZIP files I don't have to bother.

There's a second Save command in the File menu called Save As (or sometimes Page Save As on browsers) - if you ever want to change the name or destination directory when you save a file, use that. It works like that with nearly every program written since the early 1990s, so it's very useful.

 

[twofalls]

I like the idea of PDF's because I love the spirit of entrepreneurship that brings them to us, but I find that I don't care for them in practice. I'm just old fashioned in that I love the smell of ink and the heft of a book in my hands. The option now to inexpensively print to order off of Enworld is a wonderful boost to the PDF market in my opinion.

 

[Emiricol]

Sigh. Yes, and then I have to click through the directory tree. Since I've been using computers since before the first Mac came out, and have written books on such pedestrian topics as batch file programming, I'm pretty sure I've seen the Save As command before.

Nonetheless, despite the presence of that little feature (with which I then have to make all the clicks I already mentioned because I prefer it set to go where it defaults to now because that's how I work and that's therefore the most efficient for me), it is still faster for me personally to hit "save" in the popup box on a ZIP instead of hitting "open ->save as ->default directory ->subdirectory 1, 2 then 3" and so on on a PDF.

Thanks for the tip about Save As. In the last decade and a half I never saw it.