D&D 5E Perform Skill: What's it good for?

[Greenstone.Walker]

...and the only real difference is how they get there.

Not quite - the different approaches also have different consequences, which is where the "role" in roleplaying applies.

If I want to get someone to go back inside, I could use intimidation, persuasion or deception. All will result in the consequence "the person actually goes inside" but all will have different other consequences.

 

[Saeviomagy]

Not quite - the different approaches also have different consequences, which is where the "role" in roleplaying applies.

If I want to get someone to go back inside, I could use intimidation, persuasion or deception. All will result in the consequence "the person actually goes inside" but all will have different other consequences.

Only if you work from the concept that intimidation means you are personally being scary, persuasion means you get people to do things just by being nice and deception means you completely falsify your argument.

In fact, in this particular situation all three skills can be used to convince the target that it is dangerous to be outdoors, whether or not it actually is, and the consequences are almost entirely going to be dependent upon the player's description of his argument.

 

[Quickleaf]

Among the other good comments about distraction, downtime and wealthy lifestyle, I've been using Perform as a signal to be very generous with the Perform-proficient player in terms of using the Help action in regards to ability/skill checks out of combat.

Help. You can lend your aid to another creature in the completion of a task. When you take the Help action, the creature you aid gains advantage on the next ability check it makes to perform the task you are helping with, provided that it makes the check before the start of your next turn.

Can you help someone on an ability check involving a skill or tool you're not proficient in?
How far from you can the person you're helping be?
Does the way you're describing your action make sense for the DM to allow it to qualify as Help?
Is it possible to Help more than one character at a time?
Can you Help someone in an ongoing way or to aid a check they'll make in a minute or an hour, as opposed to before the start of your next turn?

For characters proficient in Perform, I generally like to rules these questions in their favor when it comes to Help.

 

[Kobold Stew]

Absolutely nothing, say it again.

Well, not quite, as we've seen. But another problem is the mechanical overlap with the (even more useless) musical instrument proficiencies.

Now I can come up with a story of what it means to be proficient with the lute but not with performance, or vice versa, or what it means to be proficient with both, but what I can't see is a DM enforcing it in play: in any context, surely, the musical instrument proficiency gives you nothing that perform doesn't as well.

Except: certain magic items require proficiency, and here the list of magic items doesn't mesh with the list in the PHB.

 

[pdzoch]

Among the other good comments about distraction, downtime and wealthy lifestyle, I've been using Perform as a signal to be very generous with the Perform-proficient player in terms of using the Help action in regards to ability/skill checks out of combat.



Can you help someone on an ability check involving a skill or tool you're not proficient in?
How far from you can the person you're helping be?
Does the way you're describing your action make sense for the DM to allow it to qualify as Help?
Is it possible to Help more than one character at a time?
Can you Help someone in an ongoing way or to aid a check they'll make in a minute or an hour, as opposed to before the start of your next turn?

For characters proficient in Perform, I generally like to rules these questions in their favor when it comes to Help.

I've employed the "Aid" rule a little more liberally when it comes to complementing skills. In the case of Perform and Deception, I will allow a player to roll with advantage if they are proficient in both when they are deceiving with a performance -- such as a fake fight to pretend to champion someone else's cause (and gain their favor), to create a sting operation and set a trap to catch a culprit ("accidentally leave a valuable item exposed/dropped), impersonating an important figure to deceive potential assassins or opposing political factions. For characters attempting to intimidate, I'll also allow an advantage if they have perform to "threaten by a display of physical or martial prowess" -- think kung fu movies and the posturing/katas done just before a fight.

I try to ensure that every skill/ability check as a game repercussion and have value to the story. Even for the "Entertainer" background, I require a perform skill check to determine quality of room and board. A failure results in the lowest possible accommodation and a "bad review" that increases the DC in the locality for the next perform. Likewise, a success results in a "good review", and a lower DC next time at the same inn.

In one of my adventures, the party was guiding a caravan through heavy fog (everyone was essentially blinded) and the Bard acted as a guide by singing from the front and everyone followed the music. I had the Bard role perform as a test of her endurance over the many hours of the trip. As a reward, she became known as the "The Guiding Song" and a local legend.

In my current game, there are numerous bards, several of them competing, and the perform skill check establishes if a bard has sufficient "star power" to speak with another bard. Likewise, too high a success in some cases turns into a threatening "star."

In the same game, several NPCs are deaf, so languages are not going to work. However, a Perform skill check enables sufficient pantomime to communicate (ad-hoc sign language).

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

Glad I'm not the only one who had that song going through their head!

Absolutely nothing, say it again.

Well, not quite, as we've seen. But another problem is the mechanical overlap with the (even more useless) musical instrument proficiencies.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I believe performance is the general skill when trying to deceive someone with a studied act.

Play the king in a disguise:
Disguise kit to make your look perfect
perform to act like you are the king
deception if someone talks to you while acting and asks questions you are not prepared for.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Absolutely nothing, say it again.

Well, not quite, as we've seen. But another problem is the mechanical overlap with the (even more useless) musical instrument proficiencies.

Now I can come up with a story of what it means to be proficient with the lute but not with performance, or vice versa, or what it means to be proficient with both, but what I can't see is a DM enforcing it in play: in any context, surely, the musical instrument proficiency gives you nothing that perform doesn't as well.

Except: certain magic items require proficiency, and here the list of magic items doesn't mesh with the list in the PHB.

Music instrument proficiencies, like gaming set proficiency are imbalanced vs thief's tools. That is a general problem. Maybe giving proficiency points and have them cost a different amount would be a good idea.
The medicine skill is also one that is as badly explained as perform. And perception is more or less too good to pass. Riding is outright missing.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Music instrument proficiencies, like gaming set proficiency are imbalanced vs thief's tools. That is a general problem. Maybe giving proficiency points and have them cost a different amount would be a good idea.
The medicine skill is also one that is as badly explained as perform. And perception is more or less too good to pass. Riding is outright missing.

Tool proficiency is a poor idea to begin with. Tools are simply how you utilize certain skills. Its weird to divorce the herbalism kit from the pertinent knowledge skills. What, you know how to use herbs, but nothing else about them? Its pointlessly overspecific in a game that uses broad strokes to cover other activities. Same thing with perform and music instrument. I think the idea was to have tools be minor benefits, similar to secondary skills in 2nd edition, but thieves tools sticks out like a sore thumb. It's clearly the most useful tool in your average adventure, yet its given equal weight with say, a gaming set (cue the the inevitable person to defend gaming set's honor as the most useful skill their 25 year ongoing campaign, sputtering about role playing not roll playing).

Shadowrun lumps the "ribbon/fluff" skills together in their own category separate from the more generically useful adventuring skills. So you aren't paying the same for "computer hacking" "shoot gun" and "deception" as "20th century comic book trivia", "miniature painting" and "accounting".

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Yes. Thiefs tools should rather be a skill. Perception maybe even a stat.