Planejammer / Spellscape

[Paul Farquhar]

It's just one thing too many really.

If there was no Astral, Phlogiston would be fine, but as it is, you have two things doing basically the same job (three if you count Ethereal), so it seams reasonable to infer that they are really the same thing.

A G.U.T. of D&D cosmology.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

...as well as seeing how the Federation deals with FR Gods.

C’mon...really? We ALL know how that works.

[video=youtube;wxT5hSBGbKE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxT5hSBGbKE[/video]
[video=youtube;oVGK3fuD5Kw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVGK3fuD5Kw[/video]

 

[gyor]

C’mon...really? We ALL know how that works.

[video=youtube;wxT5hSBGbKE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxT5hSBGbKE[/video]
[video=youtube;oVGK3fuD5Kw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVGK3fuD5Kw[/video]

FR Gods are alot more powerful and dangerous then ST Beings, with mortal servants more powerful the ST Apollo, Kirk would have alot harder time dealing with them. Closer to dealing with Q, not not as powerful as Q.

 

[Ath-kethin]

It's just one thing too many really.

If there was no Astral, Phlogiston would be fine, but as it is, you have two things doing basically the same job (three if you count Ethereal), so it seams reasonable to infer that they are really the same thing.

A G.U.T. of D&D cosmology.

That's an argument that would make sense if the two (phlogiston and Astral) were doing the same thing. But they aren't - unless, in your campaign setting, a person who levitates or flies high enough off the planet's surface ends up in the Astral plane, in which the planet's moons and starts float. Which isn't unreasonable for a fantasy world, but I don't believe it's the baseline assumption in any of them.

Or are you maintaining the basic idea of crystal spheres but placing them in the Astral? That makes sense enough, I suppose, though by that logic you can also use your levitate or fly spell to move yourself all the way to Ysgard or Gehenna. Which again is fine for a fantasy world if you want it that way, but seems a bit off to me.

 

[Staccat0]

Cool stuff I can put in my game

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

FR Gods are alot more powerful and dangerous then ST Beings, with mortal servants more powerful the ST Apollo, Kirk would have alot harder time dealing with them. Closer to dealing with Q, not not as powerful as Q.

While possibly true, it won’t stop them from TRYING. Remember the Secondary and Tertiary Directives?

Dir. 2nd: We Come In Peace

Dir. 3rd: Shoot To Kill

There’s also the issue of the information gap. At the very least, the first FR deities who draw fire from personal or ship-mounted phasers will probably get their avatars ashed if they don’t understand the power of the weapons in question. A single cruiser can render a defenseless planet lifeless, given time. Even the hand weapons are roughly equivalent to disintegrate spells when set to kill...with a huge capacity before being drained.

Capt. Tracey: “They sacrificed hundreds, just to draw us out in the open. And then they came, and they came. We drained four of our phasers, and they still came. We killed thousands and they still came.”

The Omega Glory

(And I personally wouldn’t put FR deities at Q level. In game terms, Q can essentially use Wish at will.)

 

[Paul Farquhar]

That's an argument that would make sense if the two (phlogiston and Astral) were doing the same thing. But they aren't - unless, in your campaign setting, a person who levitates or flies high enough off the planet's surface ends up in the Astral plane, in which the planet's moons and starts float. Which isn't unreasonable for a fantasy world, but I don't believe it's the baseline assumption in any of them.

Or are you maintaining the basic idea of crystal spheres but placing them in the Astral? That makes sense enough, I suppose, though by that logic you can also use your levitate or fly spell to move yourself all the way to Ysgard or Gehenna. Which again is fine for a fantasy world if you want it that way, but seems a bit off to me.

You can't reach the phlogiston simply by flying upwards, any more than you can reach the Astral. It's prime material all the way up (at least until you bump against the inside of the crystal sphere).

In either case it represents a transitory plane, the space between worlds, hyperspace. It's really an unnecessary complication from a game-play point of view (although technically not unreasonable) to have to travel through one type of hyperspace to get from Toril to Krynn, and a different type of hyperspace to get from Toril to Gehenna.

I believe that when Spelljammer was written it was intended that the "great wheel" cosmology would not be used in conjunction with it, so the steam-punk based Phlogiston would effectively replace the mysticism based Astral when players where using that setting.

 

[gyor]

While possibly true, it won’t stop them from TRYING. Remember the Secondary and Tertiary Directives?

Dir. 2nd: We Come In Peace

Dir. 3rd: Shoot To Kill

There’s also the issue of the information gap. At the very least, the first FR deities who draw fire from personal or ship-mounted phasers will probably get their avatars ashed if they don’t understand the power of the weapons in question. A single cruiser can render a defenseless planet lifeless, given time. Even the hand weapons are roughly equivalent to disintegrate spells when set to kill...with a huge capacity before being drained.



(And I personally wouldn’t put FR deities at Q level. In game terms, Q can essentially use Wish at will.)

I put them somewhere between Beings which are more like Empyreans in power and Q, AO would be at Q's level. I'm trying to think of beings in Star Trek at FR Deity power levels.

I'd say the FR deities are roughly at the power level of Ego from Guardians of the Galaxy 2, but that isn't Star Trek.

 

[gyor]

It's just one thing too many really.

If there was no Astral, Phlogiston would be fine, but as it is, you have two things doing basically the same job (three if you count Ethereal), so it seams reasonable to infer that they are really the same thing.

A G.U.T. of D&D cosmology.

If I was going to merge the Phlogiston and a plane it would be the Ethereal plane, because its connects all the Mortal worlds, the Mirror Planes (Shadowfell, Feywild), the Elemental Planes, and in the Deeper Ethereal the Astral Plane, which fits spelljammer better.

 

[delericho]

Let's say at some point over the next few months WotC announces some update to Planescape and/or Spelljammer.

I would be interested in seeing what they do with Spelljammer. I have no interest in Planescape - that particular setting never grabbed me.

This may include cherry picking the best bits of each and combining them.

In which case I'll pass. Sorry.