[Planescape] What would you want to see in a Mega-Adventure / Campaign?

[Quickleaf]

Heya, a question and a poll for you Planescape enthusiasts, cross-posted from the Piazza...

I am working on a mega-adventure/campaign for Planescape, something that I'd like to have a life outside my table (whether that means setting up a website to share it for free, seeking a publisher or self-publishing under the OGL, sending a pitch to WotC....I don't know yet). The main theme is a rift in the cosmos, a rift which threatens all the planes, Prime, Inner, and Outer. I've got a post over at Planewalker.com where I'm doing my rigorous design. I'm tentatively writing this for 5th edition rules, if it matters.

My question for you all is about embracing a diversity of PC types - primes and planars. Should I define the which prime world is threatened? Or leave it undefined for the DM to decide? Should I explicitly imperil multiple prime worlds? Or should I leave the Prime Material Plane out if it altogether (and, if so, should the nature of the rift be changed)?

Look forward to hearing your thoughts   

 

[Yora]

Why are Pregen characters and a players primer the same option? Those seem like completely different things to me. I'd vote for one, but against the other.

 

[Quickleaf]

Why are Pregen characters and a players primer the same option? Those seem like completely different things to me. I'd vote for one, but against the other.

Because I first made the poll over at the Piazza which limits you to posting 10 poll choice

So you'd like pregen PCs? But don't care about a player's primer?

 

[MoutonRustique]

Same as [MENTION=6670763]Yora[/MENTION] : pre-gen PCs =why? Player's primer = essential (I'll build my own if none is provided)

The greatest Plane Scape games I've had, had to deal with the nature of the planes themselves -not really a "person" antagonist.

So instead of a compelling BBEG (which is always a nice thing, don't get me wrong), I would say that it requires a compelling question or revelation.

What is the Harbinger House - how/why does it work? What does it mean when a Power dies? Why isn't the Athar's main point simply accepted if "gods" are "mortal"? Why is Sigil a "cage" whom does it cage? etc, etc. As an example, I feel like Tales from the Infinite Staircase was a very good concept : PCs are learning about the nature of pathways, the magic of the planes and all sorts of weird secrets along the way. There isn't really a "person" to vanquish. As a counter-point Dead Gods is fun, but I felt like the learning of the usurpation and such was the better reward - killing a god is fun, but it played better when the mystery was the driving force, not Tenebrous himself. Once the mystery is solved, it returns to a "regular", let's load up and get him-kind of game.

Also, the greatest question of all : What's up with Fell? (hehehe, see what I did there? I am a pun /master/!)

The thing is, this is, to me, very very hard to do - while I aspire to awesome PS games, the games I run tend to be more along the lines of "D&D with a twist". Which is fun, but less than I feel the setting can do.

 

[Yora]

Because I first made the poll over at the Piazza which limits you to posting 10 poll choice

So you'd like pregen PCs? But don't care about a player's primer?

The opposite. Primer is important, pregens irrelevant.

 

[Quickleaf]

The opposite. Primer is important, pregens irrelevant.

Got it. Thanks.

The greatest Plane Scape games I've had, had to deal with the nature of the planes themselves -not really a "person" antagonist.

So instead of a compelling BBEG (which is always a nice thing, don't get me wrong), I would say that it requires a compelling question or revelation.

That's a great observation. Definitely something essential to the Planescape "feel."

I should have included an option for this, but I'm wondering how important aesthetics are to people...art style, graphic design, page layout, that sort of thing?

 

[Yora]

I agree with that one. In Planescape, probably more than any other setting, it's the journey that matters much more than actually achieving something in the big picture of things. There should be a reason why the PCs are going on this journey and that makes them want to progress towards their destination despite the obstacles they encounter,And though there should be a satisfying resolution at the end that makes the whole ordeal worth it, I think the main source for a feeling of accomplishment should come from having made the journey, not so much the purpose of it.
I think a Planescape adventure could even have no villain at all. A simple delivery job could be enough, as long as the cause can be made to feel important enough.
Finding a rare crystal for a wizards magical music box probably wouldn't cut it. But getting the same gem to make a magic heart for the wizards dying daughter might.

 

[MoutonRustique]

I'm wondering how important aesthetics are to people...art style, graphic design, page layout, that sort of thing?

Sadly, I figure it's pretty high... I know I get all excited by the "blade-frills" on the pages and the off-kilter quotes jammed in every once in a while.

On the other hand, if I get a clearly presented product, I can get over almost anything - In terms of book aesthetics, 2e PS was insanely pretty! 4e... not so much. 4e did not make me dream as PS did, but it made me dream about using it for PS. (especially when themes came into play - what better mechanic than themes for factions?) On the other hand, with all the "unusual" terrain (so much that it sort of becomes the norm), the more "exactness" of 4e could make it less... flowy?

So my final answer to how important are aesthetics is : yes?

Edit:
An example of a good concept but bad execution is The Deva Spark - the concept of the creation of a new being and the question it raises with regards to what is the right thing to do is excellent PS stuff.

But the way it was presented sort of ... fell short. It wasn't clear what each encounter was supposed to convey and many felt just like "here's a cool thing to do/look at". Also the intro was terrible : pouff, you're in the Abyss! Now, just chill out in this bar!

While the idea of subtle clues is fine when things are simple, in a game about philosophy, different view points and weird, weird (not a typo) characters and situations, sometimes it's a good idea to be a bit more "in your face" about things. Make it more obvious earlier on that the demon is doing good actions in the midst of the destruction, etc, etc.

When the strange is the norm, subtle is often taken for window dressing.

 

[Quickleaf]

Here are the latest poll results as of Sept 8th. 

Note that Piazza doesn't reveal total # of voters so I had to infer that from the selection option with the highest number of votes. 

So far, a small sample of about 74 people have voted, revealing that the most important things are the Planescape feel, non-linear sandbox-ish adventures, and compelling villain(s).

_________________________________________

ENWorld (33 votes) 25 - It needs to capture that elusive Planescape feel. 24 - It needs to be more of a sandbox than a railroad. 11 - It needs to include a compelling BBEG. 9 - It needs to be a boxed set.

Other considerations:

• Should raise a compelling question or revelation.

RPG.net (37 votes) 33 - It needs to capture that elusive Planescape feel. 18 - It needs to be more of a sandbox than a railroad. 14 - It needs to include a compelling BBEG. 11 - It needs to have digital support.

Other considerations:

• Should tie into Planescape: Torment, particularly NPC cameos.
• Opinions against Faction War

Piazza (~4 votes) 4 - It needs to capture the elusive Planescape feel. 3 - It needs to be more of a sandbox than a railroad. 3 - It needs to cover a full spectrum of play.

Other considerations:

• Should have distinct Planescape aesthetics, both visual and in writing.

 

[Shemeska]

Feel above all else really IMO.

While I did place a vote for 'designed for a particular edition' let me clarify that I don't mean what rules end up being used. I mean what edition(s')'s cosmology is used. Great Wheel with a classic 2e Multiverse setup rather than a more restricted 3e setup and not the 4e World Axis since the tropes of that cosmology don't work as well IMO.