Playable character without magic items: possible ?

[Legildur]

4E?

 

[irdeggman]

Soulknife could work.

He gets enhancement bonuses to his mindblade at higher levels.

The problem with anything other than VoP is that all characters are assumed to get magic items as they level up and the CR are assigned based on this fact. So just looking for ways to get by isn't the same - a lot of character classes can make do but they are not of the same power (and probably not going to survive an appropriate CR encounter) without magic items. VoP has included in its benefits things that "make up" for not getting any magic items.

 

[JiCi]

I think talking about VOP is really not what the OP was asking, as VOP is intended to replace the normal set of magical bonuses a typical character would get form magical items.

And for the record, no, I do not like VOP as it penalizes the rest of th party too harshly for one character's build choice.

As for the OP's question, I think it is totally doable, but the party is going to be a lot weaker at higher levels than the norm, as monsters and situation are built with the assumption that the party will have access to typical amounts of magic items.

A party without magical items, will have much lower chances to hit, ACs, saves and just about anything else than a party with a reasonable selection of magical items.

Doable, but it will take a bit of tweaking in the campaign world and especially in pre-published adventures.

I would like to play in that kind of game, though.

Thanks for the backup, at least my adamantine mountain-plated warrior with adamantine tower shield can still hit hard with his adamantine bastard sword in an antimagic field than their VOP characters. In other words, can you guys keep it low with the numerous racial abilities, especially with Vow of Poverty ? I said "without magic items", not "without any kind of items" after all. Beside, I'm pretty sure a wizard can survive without magic items, but unfortunately for you guys, that same wizard cannot do so with VOP: no spellbook. Let's keep it as all classes should have an equal chance, shall we ?

Here's the thing: let's say a character wants to prove himself that he can survive with the use of magic items, BUT can use everything else. That includes alchemical items, weapon and armor modifications, mounts and other junk-like items that are useful in certain situations. Can such a character be playable ? Yes: ok / No: why ?

 

[EyeontheMountain]

Here's the thing: let's say a character wants to prove himself that he can survive with the use of magic items, BUT can use everything else. That includes alchemical items, weapon and armor modifications, mounts and other junk-like items that are useful in certain situations. Can such a character be playable ? Yes: ok / No: why ?

My answer would be depends on the level.

Level 1-10 definitely, though after 7 or 8 it will get harder. If the character is in a well balanced party ( even a bit magic (spell-wise( heavy, it would be even better for buffs to be more available.

Starting at level 11 and going up to 16 or so I would say it is getting hard, very hard. Luckily standard monsters tend to have laughable special ability DCs so saves are still possible even without magical items, but here the various classes are going to diverge more and more. I would say a warlock with the correct invocations would be the most perfect for these levels, and a straight fighter the worse.

After level 16, and maybe after 14, I think the gap would be too high. The party would not be able to keep up and would find themselves bein pounded by CR appropriate monsters.

And I do not think special materials and special alchemical items will help much. Admanantium armor and weapon will be effective though, the DR 3/- will be invaluable.

 

[Diirk]

i would not allow VOP in the party
and this is from a player the PC takes away from the group is alway beg for this or that becuase they can't own it is giveing away parts of the partys treasure and magic items and so they can't be used later and no benifet was gained such as a diffrent useful magic item
and if they think my PC is paying for thier spell componets their crazy stuiped
P.S. as soon as the group found out that the PC was giveing away MI he would no longer get any and his pathic character can whin all he want the ansewer would still be no

You sound pretty greedy here honestly. If you are in a party of 4 and noone has VOP, then you can assume you'll get roughly 1/4 of all treasure (including magic items). If someone picks up VOP, why should you suddenly start getting 1/3 of all treasure ? You aren't doing anything extra to earn it.

 

[Jack Simth]

i would not allow VOP in the party
and this is from a player the PC takes away from the group is alway beg for this or that becuase they can't own it is giveing away parts of the partys treasure and magic items and so they can't be used later and no benifet was gained such as a diffrent useful magic item
and if they think my PC is paying for thier spell componets their crazy stuiped
P.S. as soon as the group found out that the PC was giveing away MI he would no longer get any and his pathic character can whin all he want the ansewer would still be no

Provided the DM is handing out treasure at around Wealth By Level, a reasonably built Vow of Poverty character is not actually hurting the party any by giving away his fair treasure share. Seriously. VoP benefits, while static and not customizable to a specific situation, are roughly equivalent to what you can get through Wealth By Level. Now, if the VoP character is constantly begging for expensive spell components, the DM hands stuff out above standard Wealth By Level, routinely plants items that will be required later that aren't obviously so now, or similar, that's a different story; in one of those cases, the VoP character is negatively impacting the party (draining other's expected wealth in the first, not up to the party's level of power in the second, and occasionally losing the required item in the third). In most situations, though, the Vow is basically a compromise between the "no material goods" flavor and the power the game expects a character to have from items.

 

[Tetsubo]

What about Incarnum? *Become* the magic itself...

 

[SadisticFishing]

Actually, you can do some cool stuff with Vow of Poverty:

Illumian Sorceror 4/Paladin 2/Monk 1/Apostle of Peace 2/Mystic Theurge 10/Monk +1 (2) (take Ascetic Mage). You get all the power words, level 7 Arcane spells, leve 9 divinel spells (with a caster level of 19), cha to saves, cha to AC, and the ability to pacify anyone with a touch.

One thing about VoP - you need to be Good. And not just Good, but Exalted Good - can be a hassle, but I find the fact that it makes things less "I hit them they die, we take their stuff" very enjoyable.

 

[Aleolus]

My comment exactly, Tetsubo. Magic of Incarnum classes don't need to use magic items because the soulmelds they form do similar (and in some cases better) things as magic items do, use the magic item slots, but are completely customizeable, and you can change them however you want every day! My reccomendation would be the Incarnate, since they get the highest progression of soulmelds, but Totemist works as well. Soulborns, while fun to play, do need some magic items, because they don't get very many soulmelds, even at high levels (I think the most they ever get is 3)

 

[blargney the second]

Great suggestion on the incarnum! It'd be wicked in a low-magic game.