Players, DMs and Save or Die

[ThirdWizard]

A victim meeting the Bodak's gaze must make a successful Fort save (DC 15) each round, or suffer 1d6 Con damage. If the saving throw was successful, the character becomes immune to the effect of that specific Bodak's Gaze attack for 24 hours. This attack has a range of 30 feet. The save DC is Charisma-based.​

As an aside, I created some monsters for a recent adventure I wrote for my home game. They were gargoyle-like constructs (CR 11) who did Dex damage every hit. If they drop you to 0 Dex, you are turned to stone. And, they did not do piddly damage either. I love the Dex damage to petrification thing that was introduced in some spell (forgot). As they take damage, they get slower and slower, mimicking the slow change to stone which you can further add with descriptive text. Very nice.

 

[Raven Crowking]

As an aside, I created some monsters for a recent adventure I wrote for my home game. They were gargoyle-like constructs (CR 11) who did Dex damage every hit. If they drop you to 0 Dex, you are turned to stone. And, they did not do piddly damage either. I love the Dex damage to petrification thing that was introduced in some spell (forgot). As they take damage, they get slower and slower, mimicking the slow change to stone which you can further add with descriptive text. Very nice.

Agreed.

Saying that one likes the idea of including SoD effects =/= that one likes every instance of how those effects are used in the current incarnation, or that there are not better ways to model certain effects.

RC

 

[Remathilis]

That works for me, either RC's con damage version or the C&C version.

 

[Geron Raveneye]

This is scary...if we all start agreeing with each other here, will the 4E forum slowy turn to stone?

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

Agreed.

Saying that one likes the idea of including SoD effects =/= that one likes every instance of how those effects are used in the current incarnation, or that there are not better ways to model certain effects.

RC

Well, part of the problem with SoD effects is the way they're handled in the current rules. If we're going to change save-or-die effects so they no longer require you to save, or else die, I don't suppose that those of us who dislike them will dislike them so much. Of course, they're not really save-or-die effects then, so it kind of skirts the issue.

The system described by ThirdWizard isn't a SoD effect. It's a resource attrition effect, just like HP, but aimed at a more precious resource. Of course, if you've got an 11th level party, you should have some Restoration spells to throw around, but that's hardly the same kind of absolute counter that Death Ward has against SoD spells. All around, it's a better solution.

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Well, part of the problem with SoD effects is the way they're handled in the current rules. If we're going to change save-or-die effects so they no longer require you to save, or else die, I don't suppose that those of us who dislike them will dislike them so much. Of course, they're not really save-or-die effects then, so it kind of skirts the issue.

The system described by ThirdWizard isn't a SoD effect. It's a resource attrition effect, just like HP, but aimed at a more precious resource. Of course, if you've got an 11th level party, you should have some Restoration spells to throw around, but that's hardly the same kind of absolute counter that Death Ward has against SoD spells. All around, it's a better solution.

Yeah, but isn't a save or die not just a resource attrition effect, too, just aimed at an even more precious resource?

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

Yeah, but isn't a save or die not just a resource attrition effect, too, just aimed at an even more precious resource?

Well, I think that once you start setting binary conditions it's a bit difficult to argue that you're on some kind of continuum.

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Well, I think that once you start setting binary conditions it's a bit difficult to argue that you're on some kind of continuum.

Och, not really...not if you set those "binary" conditions simply as the opposite ends of that continuum, and allow different "speeds" of how you get from one to the other...and wormholes. Definitely wormholes.

(Sorry, I just feel like we all have been going 'round this carousel thread so often that I feel giddy enough to poke some fun at everything. I mean...it's a game, I am allowed to poke fun at concepts I defend as well. )

 

[Remathilis]

This is scary...if we all start agreeing with each other here, will the 4E forum slowy turn to stone?

Nah, we'll all be assimilated and turned into a giant brain in a jar...

wait, thats the wotc forums...

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Gleemax, the ultimate Brain Collector...Castle Amber strikes again! Make a Fort save or be added to the collection!