Players Want To Be Led Around By The Nose and Have NPC's Do Everything For Them

[Thistleknot]

Hello Everyone,

I have a bit of a problem in my gaming group. And it seems to be an unusual problem, as far as I can tell.

There is a majority within the group that wants the so-called "sure thing". They want everything spelled out for them, exactly. They don't want to do things for themselves, ever, and they want someone else to do it for them.

This isn't a phenomenon limited to one game. I have run a D&D 3.0 game for them for the past 14 months, and I am co-DM in a Spycraft game that they play in. This frustrates my co-DM as well, because he is in the minority in the D&D game.

In each game, they don't want to think through the information. If the objective they are supposed to accomplish isn't clear and spelled out exactly, they literally throw up their hands and ask me "What do you want us to do?" If they can't figure out what they think I want, they get frustrated and have their characters quit. They shoot down the ideas of other players because they aren't the "perfect" idea or the idea they think that I want as a DM. If they get wrapped up in an idea they don't like, they basically refuse to participate or do so half-heartedly, which results in failure and then a round of "I told you so's".

This has a tendency to frustrate me as a DM and the rest of the players as well. I would like them to do things for themselves, to think about the plot, and figure it out. I feel like it makes the players spectators within the world, and they're supposed to do things. I've talked to them about this some, and it doesn't seem to help.

But I also want them to have fun as well, since there is no point in running a game if no one has fun.

The problem here is that the ideas of fun seem to be mutually exclusive, and I like to make sure that everyone gets equal fun and time spent on their character.

So, does anyone have any ideas on what to do to try and get them to do things for themselves? After Saturday's Spycraft game, I'm just about at my wit's end.

Thank you for your time.

 

[Emiricol]

Give 'em what they want. Or, talk to them and ask why they don't take independent action. Or, dock them XP every time they take the direct path.

I dunno, I don't have that problem very often, for which I'm glad.

 

[Chimera]

Been there, done that, lost that battle.

The bottom line is, why are they playing? Obviously they aren't having a good time and aren't interested in actually playing. Is this just a social occasion for those players? Just something to do?

You and your co-DM can dumb down your play to their level, or you can get rid of them and find players who do actually want to play.

From personal experience, you're going to have a seriously hard battle to get them to wake up and be a part of the game.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

Why not just run them through Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil? Some people just like to roll dice and get their hack-n-slash in. There's nothing wrong with that.

If you're feeling held back creatively speaking, use the time to create PrCs or feats or races or templates or magic items that you think the players might enjoy. Or, heck, use them as a playtest group while you design adventures for Dungeon or whatever. A hack-n-slash group is great for playtesting.

Good luck!

 

[Saeviomagy]

How many of your players are in this apathetic group? It sounds like they're a minority, but they're a dominant minority, most likely due to their personalities.

Might I suggest that the next time they cut down someone elses plan, you ask them "well, do you have a better plan?". I'd probably also recommend that if they're constantly sabotaging plans, you encourage the group to make plans that don't involve them.

OTOH, if they're the majority of the group, then stop DMing. Tell them you're burnt out, and you'd like a break. There's not much point DMing if you don't enjoy it.

 

[molonel]

That is an odd problem. I recommend either (a) giving them what they want, or (b) either getting out, or letting someone else DM for a time. Someone recommended Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil. Since it seems to be turning into a "you" versus "them" scenario, perhaps using a module that "you" didn't make will make it a bit more impersonal and let you step back and evaluate the game without any personal attachment. It may be that they simply have a different gaming style than you. Not much you can do about that. If you try too deliberately to change them, it will only frustrate all of you.

 

[UrathDM]

Could be worse

I have had this problem. To quote one my players in a campaign I canceled recently "D&D should be light on thinking and heavy on action."

Contrary to Chimera's suggestion, they may well enjoy playing...but only for the combat elements.

I canceled my campaign because I realized the style of campaign I wanted to run was too different from what the players wanted. I wanted something with political intrigue and a "mystery" for the players to solve; they wanted "go there... kill things... take their stuff... then go there... kill tougher things... take THEIR stuff."

It is Ok, even desirable, for one or two characters to desire a simpler style - it adds to the flavor of the campaign, especially if the players do not . But it is destructive for the majority of the players to want a different style.

Style preferences do not change often, easily, or on command. A preference is a subjective thing; like whether or not you like the taste of a food, or a favorite color.

I wish you luck, but I suspect that your best choices will be to either "keep it simple" or find more players who share your style preference.

 

[Varianor Abroad]

Sounds like beer 'n pretzels hack & slashers to me. There's plenty of people who love that kind of action. And, there's nothing wrong with that.

So, if you like your players, give them what they want and hide what you want in the middle of it. That or I suggest trying an online gamesite where you can recruit people who are agreeable to the kind of game that you want to run. (Try checking out games here, or at www.rondaksportal.com, for a while and then asking some folks to join you.)

Good luck!

 

[Desdichado]

How many of your players are in this apathetic group? It sounds like they're a minority, but they're a dominant minority, most likely due to their personalities.

Actually, the first post says clearly that they are the majority.

Me? I couldn't DM a group like that and enjoy it. Sorry. This train's left the station. Find someone else.

I can't make a game fun for the players if I can't enjoy it myself, and players who are just there to kill some stuff and take it's stuff don't cut it for me anymore.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

Have them wake up on a strange Plane. Nothing is around them, except complete white. Keep a straight face, and an open mind. Make them think their way out. Just to make sure they don't sit there doing what you've described, knock 1d4 HP off each of them every minute. You can explain it off as harmful effects of the Plane if you want.

Don't plan on how they should get out. That way, if they suggest something, and try it...and it works, maybe they'll be more open to that kind of thing later. And then, if they manage to get out, you can get a nice plot with a BBEG that did that to them and have them go off figuring that out.

I did that for one of my groups that had the same problem...WOW, did it work. That first minute before I started taking off HP, they tried to metagame thier way out...then I rolled dice...and downed thier HP...and the PCs eyes went wide the moment before they finally started trying things in a panic.