Point Buy System

[Garrett843]

I was looking at the PC's for the world's largest dungeon and every single one of them seems to have been made from point buy. Do most DM's choose to use this system or is that just a coincidence? It might just be my play style but i prefer my characters to be slightly overpowered so i have the ability to through things at them of a higher CR than they should actually be able to fight. I find this to add more excitement to the game. Just looking for others opinions on this if i could.

 

[Christian]

Well, if you want your characters to be slightly overpowered, then you want to use point-buy with a high point value. What you get when you roll is some characters that are slightly underpowered, some characters that are slightly overpowered, and a few characters that are extremely overpowered. (But rarely PCs that are highly underpowered, because for some reason everyone re-rolls those when they turn up. ) Many DMs prefer point-buy because they don't like dealing with a group where the PC power levels are highly variable ...

 

[Garrett843]

When i said slightly overpowered I might have exaggerated. I am starting a new campaign soon and each person has 48 points on the point buy system.

 

[Nonlethal Force]

I think many people use point buy, but I wouldn't say most. There are plenty of DMs out there who use 3d6 (in the order rolled), 4d6 drop lowest (in any order), 4d6 (reroll any 1s and then drop lowest), and even 5d6 (drop lowest 2).

If you like overpowered characters, why not try a 36 or 40 point-buy system. I tend to like overpowered characters myself and am happy with a 32 point-buy system, though.

Another system I used to use until I got tired of always having to deal with a jerk I no longer play with was a system that ignored the "scaling" you get for higher level attribute scores in a point buy system. Here were the rules, feel free to use them:

1. You choose yur own ability scores.

2. They may be any number between 3 and 18.

3. When you are done, the sum of the scores [STR, DEX, CON, INT, WIS, CHA] must be 84.

Now, that system worked great because it allows plenty of play, caps players from abusing it high by saying a score can't go over 18, and the general array people used was: 18, 16, 14, 14, 12, 10. But, I met a jerk who was only about min/maxing. He didn't care about reality nor even roleplaying. He wanted to kill things and only kill things. So, he submitted a fighter one day with the following scroes: STR (18), DEX (18), CON (18), WIS (9), INT (18), CHA (3). While the character was legal, I think you can see playability issues. The player said, "My guy knows he's irritating and ugly because his low CHA, so he just won't talk."

I had to laugh. I didn't really mind the high stats so much ... but our group is all about roleplay. We are about 90% roleplay and 10% combat when we game. This guy wouldn't (and didn't fit). After that, I changed the rules just so I wouldn't have to deal with the situation again. Rule #2 became:

2. They may be any number between 3 10 and 18.

Now, this system still can create some VERY powerful characters. You can tweak the power easily by tweking the number the scores must equal in the end. As an example of the power, the array 18, 18, 18, 10, 10, 10 (54 pt equivalent) is still legit. But I found most of the players went to something more reasonable - like 18, 16, 14, 14, 12, 10 (44 pt equivalent). As you can see, it does add back in flexibility as all characters need not be the same point buy.



But, in the end I went back to using a 32 point buy. It's much more common and people know how to use it already.

 

[Garrett843]

Ok for my first dm time i will try the 32 point buy then i will probably make it a lot easier to start then. Thanks a ton.

 

[Dimwhit]

I've found in my campaign that whoever it is that is DMing doesn't even look at our stats. So it doesn't matter how we come up with it. Most of my group has E-Tools roll the stats for them.

 

[Garrett843]

It just doesn't seem fair to some of the PC's if they have average stats like 18 14 14 12 12 10 and some other character has 18 18 16 16 14 14

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

I was looking at the PC's for the world's largest dungeon and every single one of them seems to have been made from point buy. Do most DM's choose to use this system or is that just a coincidence? It might just be my play style but i prefer my characters to be slightly overpowered so i have the ability to through things at them of a higher CR than they should actually be able to fight. I find this to add more excitement to the game. Just looking for others opinions on this if i could.

Most GMs use it, according to polls here. (They're biased, of course.) IME, out of all the GMs I've had, only one allows dice-rolling, and only for his DnD campaign. (Anytime he runs Modern, it's point buy.) Other than him, every GM who used dice-rolled stats switched to point buy.

Funny thing - even some of the GMs who liked point buy rolled in the one dice-rolled campaign. (I elected to use point buy, though.) They say the dice rolling is fun, but it makes the actual gaming less fun.

Now, I'm a big confused by your statement. Are you the DM for a WLD campaign? And you allowed the players to make characters without oversight? In order to avoid accusations of cheating, they probably would go for point buy.

If you wish to challenge PCs more, I'd say use higher CR opponents. You don't have to pick out higher CR monsters from a book, either - a monster with a class level or two can be a nasty surprise. (Think giant with true strike. Yes, the boulder does hit.)

 

[Man in the Funny Hat]

Many DMs prefer point-buy because they don't like dealing with a group where the PC power levels are highly variable ...

Well, I think that most DM's prefer point-buy because too many people are under the impression that if my PC has higher stats than your PC, then my PC has an unfair advantage - that my character is then inherently more fun. Too many players then unnecessarily complain about that so DM's deal with it by using PB.

It's not as if I hate point-buy (I'd use it as a player if that's what the DM wanted without any problems - though I strongly prefer some method of rolling dice instead) but that I disagree intensely with the suggestion that PB makes things inherently fair. Even if you do use PB power levels are inherently highly variable. A 5th level fighter is not equal in power to a 5th level monk, who is not equal to a 5th level sorceror, and so on. This is then doubly, and quadruply true once you factor in skill and feat choices, magic items, and even the personality the player gives the character.

Limiting all PC's to the exact same stat potential does not ever "level the playing field" in any way because stats alone do not determine the inherent power level and more importantly the FUN level of a given character. Abilty scores are only one of many factors and the most important factor is the player attitude. When a player can accept that, "My enjoyment in playing MY character is not dependant upon the stats of someone ELSE'S character," then stats will assume their rightful place in the greater scheme of things.

Having said all that, to the OP's point I think that polls here at least show a preference for PB over other methods. This should not be taken as anything like an accurate sample. Random polls only show the preferences of those who respond, not a genuine cross-section of players, and I believe that among those who DO prefer point-buy they are more vocal about advocating point-buy as well. Additionally, among those who advocate for point-buy there is a MAJOR spread in the number of points actually used. 25, 28, 38... so the use of PB in and of itself is not an accurate determinative of the preferred power level for games. I think a scientific poll of DM's would likely show that the most common method is still dice, and the most common dice method is the default in the PH - 4d6 arranged as desired.

(There's still something masochistically appealing about the Ironman method - 3d6 in order even though I've never used it.

 

[Question]

Some classes(like the paladin) i wouldnt even dare play unless it was a high point buy or i got a good roll.

You need 4 good stats FFS. You just cant do that on a 32 pt buy.