Poison and Saves

[isoChron]

Sorry if this question has already been answered, but I can't find a topic.

Situation: PC gets a cup of poison (sleeping poison) from a friend (party member) and drinks it because the friend tells him it is tea.
Question: Does he get a Saving Throw against poison even if he drinks the "tea" voluntary ?

In the PHB : ... poisoned food or drink ... both saving throws. Seems similar to me.

 

[Crothian]

Ya, he gets a saving throw, the only he doesn't is when he willingly chooses to not get one.

 

[isoChron]

Thanks, that's what I thought.
But what if he is told it is a Cure xxx Wounds-potion ?
Normaly you have a save even against Cure xxx Wounds.
You drink that potion, thinking it is giving a desired effect, and oups! it is a poison. You didn't want to save against healing so do you get a save against the poison even now ?

My DM told me my character gets no save 'cause my character drank the potion/poison willingly (errr voluntary? ...whatever).

 

[Crothian]

well, with poisons you only don't get a saving throw if you choose not to. With cure spells you only get a saving throw if you choose to resist the spell. However, there is a middle ground and that is just drinking it and see what happens. If it's good it cures you (becasue you are not actively resisting it) and if it's poison you get a saving throw (because you are not actively allowing it to effect you).

 

[AuraSeer]

I always give Fortitude saves against harmful effects, even when you expect something beneficial. It'd be stupid to think that your body surrenders to poison or disease just because your mind got tricked.

You can forgo Will or Reflex saves, because they take some action (mental or physical) on your part. Fortitude just seems like something you don't have control over.

 

[Li Shenron]

I always give Fortitude saves against harmful effects, even when you expect something beneficial. It'd be stupid to think that your body surrenders to poison or disease just because your mind got tricked.

At least in the case of poison and disease, I agree completely. You can't prevent your body to resist the poison only because you WANT to be poisoned.

Well, you may say that the human mind can somehow interact with metabolism (and in medicine it's well known that a really "willing" patient has better chance to win a disease), but I wouldn't let you surrender so easily your Fortitude ST in this 2 cases. Maybe there is a specific psionic ability fot it?

 

[isoChron]

Thanks for the answers. I just have to convince my DM but with your answers to back up I think he will surrender

 

[Darklone]

It's easy: Fort save means your body does not like the digested thing and tries to resist it, probably removing it from your stomach rather fast. Cure things feel good.

Sleep spell... PC starts to feel sleepy... he notices something is wrong... adrenaline kicks in (best drug on earth)... he resists. Probably.

 

[the Jester]

Poison should, imho, always allow a save.

 

[Endur]

Its up to your GM.

Saving throws against ingested poisons can come from a variety of sources.

i.e. you tasted the cup and realized it tasted funny, so you didn't actually drink.

or you drank the poisoned wine, but then immediately threw up or spit out the wine

or you drank it and your stomache and general constituition is so tough that the wine didn't affect you.

If your GM wants to have a poison that affects anyone that drinks it with no saving throw, he can certainly have a poison like that.

Tom

Sorry if this question has already been answered, but I can't find a topic.

Situation: PC gets a cup of poison (sleeping poison) from a friend (party member) and drinks it because the friend tells him it is tea.
Question: Does he get a Saving Throw against poison even if he drinks the "tea" voluntary ?

In the PHB : ... poisoned food or drink ... both saving throws. Seems similar to me.