D&D 5E (2024) Preferences in a New Official 5.5e Specific Setting

[Hussar]

I like this, but it is hard to do in the current rules as a settimg that is defined by those rules.

Take Rome. If everyday Romans ar3 supposed to be playable, you cannot be restricted to that map. Many Romans come from further afield. If the people in the port should be understandable much less playable, the world needs more than southern Europe and SWANA region.

Truth is, unless ypu go way out of your way to close the known world in or go way back to the dawn of civilization, the known world has never been that small.

Well, kinda/sorta. Most Romans didn't come from further afield. But, that's not really the point.

In a setting that large - say a very large island about 1000 miles in diameter (that's damn near a continent really), you have MORE than enough space to plonk down all 11 races, have enough biomes to handle pretty much any critter save the really extreme ones and more than enough space to have all sorts of communities.

I mean, just think of it in real world terms. How many different cultures would you find in that circle I defined? If we replace cultures with species, (not as analogues, just saying that where the Celts lived, now dwarves live in that region, where the Gauls lived, that's elves, where the Goths hung out, that's where you find the human nations, etc) you have more than enough geography.

I mean, good grief, Middle Earth is about that size. And we have, what, a half dozen different intelligent species? Elf, man, dwarf, hobbit, orc, goblin, and I'm sure I'm forgetting some. If it's good enough for Tolkien, it's probably good enough for D&D. Doing a bit of Googling, and the Shire to Minas Tirith is the same distance as Oxford to Venice. So, yeah, that's LOTS of geography.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Well, kinda/sorta. Most Romans didn't come from further afield. But, that's not really the point.

In a setting that large - say a very large island about 1000 miles in diameter (that's damn near a continent really), you have MORE than enough space to plonk down all 11 races, have enough biomes to handle pretty much any critter save the really extreme ones and more than enough space to have all sorts of communities.

I mean, just think of it in real world terms. How many different cultures would you find in that circle I defined? If we replace cultures with species, (not as analogues, just saying that where the Celts lived, now dwarves live in that region, where the Gauls lived, that's elves, where the Goths hung out, that's where you find the human nations, etc) you have more than enough geography.

I mean, good grief, Middle Earth is about that size. And we have, what, a half dozen different intelligent species? Elf, man, dwarf, hobbit, orc, goblin, and I'm sure I'm forgetting some. If it's good enough for Tolkien, it's probably good enough for D&D. Doing a bit of Googling, and the Shire to Minas Tirith is the same distance as Oxford to Venice. So, yeah, that's LOTS of geography.

Middle Earth still had people from further away affected the action. In a dnd 5e setting version, you'd want to have playable Easterlings, which means knowing more than lotr ever showed about them.

Now i think you could set the action in such a small area, especially with how 5e treats setting lore. But the book would have half page sections on places outside the area of focus.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I will give an example using my own very 5e setting, humorously named Islands World.

The largest landmass in IW is a little smaller than Australia, and it isn't even where the focus of the setting lies. Instead, the real action is in the Arcipellago of the Turtle, which is roughly analogous to Indonesia but a little more spread out with a central island shaped like a turtle with its head looking to the side.

But the Arcipellago is defined in part by the old empires of the Lands of The Three Moons, which is that Australia sized landmass. The Empire of Capet is waning and the Empire of Albarona is aggresively waxing, and both have principalities of the Turtle that they have taken over within the last 15 years.

To define The Turtle, you have to describe the other lands at least a little, because there are many people from those placess in the arcipelago.

 

[Hussar]

Middle Earth still had people from further away affected the action. In a dnd 5e setting version, you'd want to have playable Easterlings, which means knowing more than lotr ever showed about them.

Now i think you could set the action in such a small area, especially with how 5e treats setting lore. But the book would have half page sections on places outside the area of focus.

Meh, why would you have playable Easterlings? They barely appear in the stories and have pretty much no role.

Like I said, the point isn't to play Middle Earth Role Play. We already have that. The point is that in the area that the Lord of the Rings takes place in includes half a dozen or more different species. It's more than big enough to have the PHB species and still have tons of space left over.

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

I guess a future setting wouldn't be only a world or planet but a wildspace or solar system. Maybe it would be a cluster of wildspaces, with the option of using "stargates" to explore other worlds.

We should keep the idea of a possible Dark Sun spin-off where we can "borrow" our favorite elements but allowing creative freedom for player options and monsters.

An update of "Councyl of Wyrms" would need something like a dragon-monster class and this would mean a lot of work for game designers, and time for playtest and feedback.

A setting can't be only like a "snow globe" or a electric toy train always with the same railroad where the children only can watch. It has to be interactive and the players to feel inspiration to create their own stories. A setting has to be designed to allow multiple spin-off.

It needs its own style or identity, enough brand power.

 

[Muso]

For sure nothing related to any MtG setting.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Meh, why would you have playable Easterlings? They barely appear in the stories and have pretty much no role.

Because they are right there, not actually that far away, and people will want to play them.

Like I said, the point isn't to play Middle Earth Role Play. We already have that.

Seriously? You really think that i was takimg the example as literaly what you want the setting to be? Come on.

The point is that in the area that the Lord of the Rings takes place in includes half a dozen or more different species. It's more than big enough to have the PHB species and still have tons of space left over.

And my point is that unless it is a dawn of civilization game, even islands have neighbors that affect them. I am not sure that a setting made to avoid that would easily be a 5e setting per the thread premise. Like I wouldmt consider the Nentir Vale setting appropriate for a setting made for 5e.

And it is easily fixed by keeping the regional neighbors to half-page writeups and focusing the action on the smaller region.

 

[Hussar]

Meh, I started playing D&D with The Known World. That's about exactly the size I was talking about and it had everything you needed for D&D. To me, all that other stuff is just a waste of time. I was asked what my preferences are. Well, that's my preference. Keep it small, focused and self contained. Which, to me, translates to manageable, and detailed enough that all the crap work is done for me.

Here's the Known World as it existed when I started D&D gaming:

 

[Yaarel]

I guess a future setting wouldn't be only a world or planet but a wildspace or solar system. Maybe it would be a cluster of wildspaces, with the option of using "stargates" to explore other worlds.

I think you are right that a D&D world setting needs to think about the wildspace system that is in. Then the nearby moons and planets might also be an origin for certain species and cultures.

We should keep the idea of a possible Dark Sun spin-off where we can "borrow" our favorite elements but allowing creative freedom for player options and monsters.

2024 Dark Sun can present player options in three separate sections. During session zero, the DM determines which sections are in play.

Section 1: strictly old school Dark Sun except without slavery. Tyranny, environmental nihilism, and desperation of poverty and famine still apply. This section is a mini Players Handbook with the relevant species, classes, subclasses, and backgrounds, fully rewritten for the Dark Sun flavor and context.

The only species are:
. Human
. Elf (Athas lineage = Wood mechanically for speed but flavors for wasteland nomads)
. Dwarf
. Mul (= 2024 Orc mechanically for relentless but flavors as very tall statuesque Dwarf, and can only reproduce if by means of magic)
. Goliath (nicknamed "half giants")
. Halfling
. Thri-kreen

The only class options are:
. Fighter subclassing Champion, Psi Warrior, Battlemaster, and Gladiator (either as new background or new subclass)
. Rogue subclassing Thief, Soulknife, and Assassin (with "Troubadour" musician background)
. Ranger subclassing Hunter and Shadow
. Druid subclassing new "Preserver"
. Sorcerer subclassing new "Defiler"
. Warlock subclassing "Templar" Sorcerer-King patron
. Psion class (hopefully published first for generic D&D, and afterward Dark Sun also referring to it)
. Cleric subclassing new Elementalist domain (alternatively this is instead Druid subclasses of Land, Sea, plus new Fire and Air, and the Preserver relating to plant)

Surmising from the UA Apocalyptic Subclasses: the 5e Sorcerer which didnt exist in 2e now represents the 2e Defiler Magic-User, and relates conceptually to the defiling by the "Sorcerer" Kings. Preserver magic equates to the primal power source, thus the 5e Druid class appears to represent Preserver magic. As such, the strictly old school section doesnt offer the Wizard class as an option, since it is the 5e Sorcerer that represents the 2e Magic-User, not the 5e Wizard.

These section 1 player options define and curate the Dark Sun setting.

Section 2. This is an optional expansion of player options. It briefly recommends how to reflavor certain species and classes to make sense in the context of the Dark Sun setting.

Additional species mentioned include: Dray ancestry Dragonborn, Aarakocra birdfolk, Pterran Lizardfolk. I consider 2024 Goliath as a defacto Goliath-Genasi merger, but Genasi as a separate species from the Elemental Planes can make sense too.

The dwindling Dark Sun regions of "Positive Material" are Fey Crossings, whence Fey species are possible if rare, including the Eladrin lineage Elf and maybe High lineage on the Fey side of a Crossing.

The expanding "Negative Material" regions are Shadow Crossings, whence possible playable Undead species and significant Shadow and Necromant options. The "Gray" is Shadowfell. The "Black" is the Deep Shadow where the domains of dread exist including the one that imprisons Rajaat the first Sorcerer. Shadowfell is surprisingly important to Dark Sun flavor.

Epic boons transform into a Shadow Sorcerer-King or a Fey Avangion.

Additional classes include: Barbarian Berserker and Beast that might relate to Halfling culture; Bard understood as a psionic class with Valor and Glamour; Monk Hand, Elemental and Shadow; Ranger Beast and Fey; and possibly Paladin Fey Ancients and Vengeance.

It is tricky to introduce more Sorcerer and Warlock subclasses because of how Defiling works, and same goes for the Wizard class, but Shadow necromancy and Fey illusion can make sense thematically.

Section 3: This section offers environmental hope. Unknown to the towns of the Table Lands, there is a subterranean civilization around aquifers, elsewhere on planet Athas, working successfully to replenish elemental Water. They defend against those suffering waterless desperation but try to be responsible where they can. The civilization is advanced magitech, with Positive Material Fey allies.

Sections 2 and 3 are a smorgasbord of player options. The DM determines some or all of them, if any. The DM can also add whatever options one feels like.

A setting can't be only like a "snow globe" or a electric toy train always with the same railroad where the children only can watch. It has to be interactive and the players to feel inspiration to create their own stories. A setting has to be designed to allow multiple spin-off.

Pretty much any kitchen sink setting can spin off in any direction. The DM needs to remember that during session zero, it is just as important to remove player options as it is to add new player options, in order to define a new setting.

 

[Uni-the-Unicorn!]

so if you were playing a Level 15 Wizard how wou you do that and remain low magic?

I don’t play the wizard, but my DM has said that he is the most powerful wizard in the world. So he is basically unique (as we all are really). So I would say that understanding guides how you play him.

I do know he seems to have a lot fewer spells than what people around here seem to have access to. We also have very little magic items and I don’t think the wizard has one at all.