Presitge Class Theory...

[breschau]

As we've heard Saga and Tome of Battle are previews of 4th Edition. In Saga classes have access to 20 some talents spread out over 3-5 talent trees. More potent talents have prerequisite weaker talents from the same tree...

Something interesting occurred to me looking over Saga. The Jedi is split into three classes, a core and two prestiges. The first prestige, Jedi Knight, requires the character be 7th-level, and the second, Jedi Master, requires the character be 12th-level...

With all the talk of Heroic (1st through 10th), Paragon (11th-20th), and Epic (21st-30th) style characters, and the "functional equivalent" of prestige classes...

I'm thinking the new "prestige" system will essentially be advanced talent trees tied to Paragon status, and even more powerful "prestige" classes will be tied to Epic status. Doing this would greatly reduce the need for complicated multi-classing rules and allow even single class characters to advance in interesting ways (by picking appropriate Paragon, and later Epic Talent Trees).

Further, the recent blog about multi-classing included a ranger/cleric/wizard, covering three of the four roles. If you restrict multi-classing to new roles only (i.e. you have fighter levels, so you can only multi-class into a leader, striker, or controller class), that would limit the rule set to four separate classes.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Further, the recent blog about multi-classing included a ranger/cleric/wizard, covering three of the four roles. If you restrict multi-classing to new roles only (i.e. you have fighter levels, so you can only multi-class into a leader, striker, or controller class), that would limit the rule set to four separate classes.

That doesn't fit the "any combo, any time" statements we've heard.

But I'd agree with your prestige class theory -- the 10-level breaks would be logical places to change the mechanics up a bit and insert new options, sort of like "name level" in 1E.

 

[Reaper Steve]

That doesn't fit the "any combo, any time" statements we've heard.

Unless 'combo' refers to combo of roles, not combo of classes.

But I'm inclined to think they are referring to classes, so you could be a fighter/ranger is you so choose...

 

[Asmor]

I don't know how much we'll see an advancement like the whole Jedi -> Jedi Knight -> Jedi Master thing, but I think there is merit to the idea. Particularly, I think it makes sense for prestige classes to activate in tiers. Base class talents all have to fit a certain power level, since they'll all be available from relatively low levels... This provides a natural way to create more powerful abilities and limit them to higher level characters.

 

[Jack99]

Unless 'combo' refers to combo of roles, not combo of classes.

But I'm inclined to think they are referring to classes, so you could be a fighter/ranger is you so choose...

I think Mike mentionned (as an example of the any combo statement) a ranger/cleric/wizard combo.

 

[Intrope]

Here's a tidbit: we're working on multiclassing right now. One of my directives to the dev team was that I'd like to play a CENSORED ranger/cleric/wizard in a playtest. We'll see if we make that work.

Making a Rgr/Clr/Wiz useful and non-broken would be something of a trick!

I'm guessing that CENSORED is either Half-Elf (aren't they the only race that could be a Rgr/Clr/Wiz, pre-3rd edition?) or something we haven't seen any mention of at all.

 

[Reaper Steve]

I think Mike mentionned (as an example of the any combo statement) a ranger/cleric/wizard combo.

Right...but that could be viewed as a striker/leader/controller combo. (And my fighter/ranger example wasn't the best, as that would be a defender/striker.)

Granted, I'll be the first to admit that this approach is unlikely at best and they are referring to class combos.

But I do wonder what ultility there will be in same role combos, like a warlord/cleric.

 

[Sir Brennen]

With all the talk of Heroic (1st through 10th), Paragon (11th-20th), and Epic (21st-30th) style characters, and the "functional equivalent" of prestige classes...

One thing discussed in the recent podcast was that the "level breaks" aren't really mechanical in nature - just more reflective of the types of adventures characters have at those levels and the types of stories the DM tells for his world. They aren't even necessarily as clear cut, either; an extremely populous, magic-rich world might not be considered "epic" until 25th level, for example.

 

[breschau]

Q: Will there be any game mechanic changes moving from the heroic to the paragon, and finally the epic tiers of play? Or is it just a stylistic change?

A: It's both. It's a stylistic transition. Not hard edged boundaries. Not fundamentally different. There are mechanical changes that happen at those tiers. Mechanics informed by what tier you're playing at.

So that's a yes, there are mechanical changes between tiers.

 

[Merlion]

I don't know how much we'll see an advancement like the whole Jedi -> Jedi Knight -> Jedi Master thing, but I think there is merit to the idea. Particularly, I think it makes sense for prestige classes to activate in tiers. Base class talents all have to fit a certain power level, since they'll all be available from relatively low levels... This provides a natural way to create more powerful abilities and limit them to higher level characters.

I hope that they don't go this route, especially not as something built in.

I would much rather they make base classes interesting enough that you might actually choose to stay with them, and leave prestige classes as they are.