D&D 5E Psionics in Tasha

[WayOfTheFourElements]

LOL Um, no. DMs get it wrong for players all the time. That's how groups fall apart.

The DM is right by definition. Because the DM arbitrates the game world and is above the Mike's Book of Gameplay Suggestions.

Not all groups are ideal. They're better off falling apart. I see no issue.

 

[Aaron L]

I think taking the sorcerer, giving them the ability to ignore verbal components (or just giving them subtle magic for free), swapping the spell casting stat to intelligence and listing the optional spell point rules in the side bar as mandatory, and boom you have psionic from 2e... More or less.

"More more or less?"

Did... did you ever read the Complete Psionics Handbook? It was a skill-based system, more akin to Proficiency rolls with power points than anything to do with the magic system.

Maybe you meant 5E or something? I have no idea how it worked in that system.

I would have much preferred that they released no psionics system than just spells labelled as psionic.

 

[WayOfTheFourElements]

WotC may still create a workable psionics system down the road when this one bombs. You can settle if you like.

I'm not settling. I'm very happy with the system. It provides me framework. I can improvise the rest.

 

[Maxperson]

Maybe you need to look at the factor all those groups have in common?

Different DMs and players involved with DM bad decisions. That was easy.

 

[Maxperson]

A side question.

From your underlining of the words, I assume you think this is too powerful for sorcerers to be allowed to do.

If this too powerful for sorcerers to do.... why would it be okay for "psions" to do it? And aren't those "Psionic abilities" going to start with a basic version that costs 0 points? Something that may look, for example, like the Mind Sliver cantrip or Message?





Sorcerers.


I will say more than a single word. Sorcerers by their fluff channel and manipulate their internal power, which is classified as Arcane magic. In fact, let me ask you this question. If Arcane magic was solely the province of manipulating external energy, why then does sleeping allow you to recover spell slots? And why do you have different levels of spell slots based upon your level and experience?

Those factors indicate to me that Arcane energy is just as much internal energy, as it is external. So, saying "Psionics aren't magic because they are focused on an internal well of power" seems to break with how magic is presented, which is both an internal and external source of power.



Well, the committee were the fans. The things they were excited about we constantly tore apart. Maybe this isn't the best design ever conceived, but don't act like they didn't try. They did try, repeatedly, and the fans told them no.





Max, this isn't going to bomb.

Even if, even if the majority of players despise the the psionic spells in this book, it will sell well and be well recieved. Why? Because it offers 27 new class options. It offers new familiars. It offers new spells. It offers a new system for character creation. It offers new magic items.

This book is going to be a hit, because of all the other stuff in it. And the psionic spells are good, so they will be liked. Not because they are psionics, but because they are good and interesting spells.

Maybe they will release a UA for their 8th or 9th attempt at a full Psion class after this, but we are getting psionic subclasses and spells, and people are going to like them. And WoTC is likely to put their energy to something new, and put down their five year burden.

I didnt say the book would bomb. If the psionics portion bombs, they will know about it.

 

[Maxperson]

The DM is right by definition. Because the DM arbitrates the game world and is above the Mike's Book of Gameplay Suggestions.

This is false and had been in every edition made. Having the authority to do anything is not the same as being right. Rule 0 does not equal right.

 

[WayOfTheFourElements]

This is false and had been in every edition made. Having the authority to do anything is not the same as being right. Rule 0 does not equal right.

The DM is the only one with the authority to define right and wrong in game, though players can decide to negotiate with the all mighty DM or decide leave the table (by joining another table, starting a new table, or leaving the hobby, which are all fine options, in my opinion).

 

[Aldarc]

@Maxperson, I hope you understand now what it is like to argue with Maxperson.

 

[wingsandsword]

Sorcerers.


I will say more than a single word. Sorcerers by their fluff channel and manipulate their internal power, which is classified as Arcane magic. In fact, let me ask you this question. If Arcane magic was solely the province of manipulating external energy, why then does sleeping allow you to recover spell slots? And why do you have different levels of spell slots based upon your level and experience?

Those factors indicate to me that Arcane energy is just as much internal energy, as it is external. So, saying "Psionics aren't magic because they are focused on an internal well of power" seems to break with how magic is presented, which is both an internal and external source of power.

You get your ability to cast arcane spells back by resting through the mental rest, because of the mental focus required to shape those external energies. It takes a lot of willpower and focus to cast arcane spells, the mental rest and recuperation is what is important.

The idea that arcane magic comes from within is so absurd and breaks so much established D&D lore that it's not worth even giving serious thought to, it is to be dismissed out of hand as inherently ridiculous. Sorcerers have an innate talent for directing and channeling magical energy, but it's not from within them. Whoever wrote fluff saying otherwise, quite bluntly, was creating major contradictions in the lore.

 

[wingsandsword]

A side question.

From your underlining of the words, I assume you think this is too powerful for sorcerers to be allowed to do.

If this too powerful for sorcerers to do.... why would it be okay for "psions" to do it? And aren't those "Psionic abilities" going to start with a basic version that costs 0 points? Something that may look, for example, like the Mind Sliver cantrip or Message?





Sorcerers.


I will say more than a single word. Sorcerers by their fluff channel and manipulate their internal power, which is classified as Arcane magic. In fact, let me ask you this question. If Arcane magic was solely the province of manipulating external energy, why then does sleeping allow you to recover spell slots? And why do you have different levels of spell slots based upon your level and experience?

Those factors indicate to me that Arcane energy is just as much internal energy, as it is external. So, saying "Psionics aren't magic because they are focused on an internal well of power" seems to break with how magic is presented, which is both an internal and external source of power.

Or, to put it in specific examples from the lore that specifies that it is not internal and is ambient in the world.

If magic came from within, in Forgotten Realms, the death of Mystryl due to Karsus's Folly wouldn't have caused magic to go wild then fade for several minutes, and the death of Mystra wouldn't have caused the Spellplague. In Dragonlance, the loss of the 3 Gods of Magic, and their gift to the world in the form of arcane magic, in the time between the Chaos War and the War of Souls wouldn't mean that Arcane magic was lost to the world and they had to discover a completely new form of magic in that time that didn't even fit D&D forms of magic to the point that TSR used a non-D&D game system to represent that era, that or they had to find old magic items and plunder them for the magical energies trapped in them as the last remnants of Arcane magic in the world.

That's 2 of the major D&D settings that would have major world-sweeping metaplot events (2 in FR, 1 in Dragonlance) that just plain wouldn't work if Arcane magic worked like you described.